So they now admit the "vaccine" .....

[NEED-A-VETTE]

Originally Posted by aerovette

Based on the performance of prior vaccines
Based on the Virologists and epidemiologists messaging
Based on the Government's communication
Based on the media's messaging
Based on the dictionary definition of a vaccine...

There was no reason to believe that cases of Covid would INCREASE, post vaccination. We were deceived and if, in 2019 or earlier, you believed anything about vaccines other than what was communicated, I am VERY sure you were in the vast minority.

Never did I hear any doctor or scientist PRIOR to the release of the vaccine say "Hold on people, just so you know, the number of cases will likely increase even with a vaccine and people will still spread it even though they feel just fine". We were told herd immunity needed to be achieved and there were two paths. Illness and vaccination. Then it changed to only vaccination. Then it changed to an impossibility. Did they have this knowledge and withhold it? Did they somehow think we already knew better?

Why was there not reason to believe this? This is generally how something moves from pandemic to endemic. Cases come up and down and mutate and kill until they develop into something less deadly. Even in the presence of vaccines. Spanish flu, for example.

Even modern flu, my doctor tells me that the vaccine may not prevent the flu. But I will have acquired immunity that should prevent it from being severe.

There are no absolutes on either side. I did not and do not live my life any differently, glued to the news, waiting for someone to tell me to come out from under the bed. Nor am I living my life trying to play “gotcha” with every headline I see from either side.

Covid will not go away. It will become endemic. Life will go on.

[Giraffe (He/Him)]

Originally Posted by NEED-A-VETTE

I won’t be getting a toaster. It’s not even the fancy one.

I couldn't operate one anyway. I eat like an unrestricted 7 year old.

[NEED-A-VETTE]

Originally Posted by VITE1

And why is that? Its due to the hysteria that has driven people to make moronic decisions just so they CA say " I did SOMETHING"!


And many,if not most HC workers are required to get the flu vax.

Yep. Annual flu vaccine, plus checked for TB annually and other vaccines are required to be up to date.

A condition of my employment was getting blood work done to check for immunity against specific diseases. At the time I thought it was silly because I had my vaccination record which clearly showed I had had all my vaccinations (from childhood up into adulthood). Weeeeeeelllll…I actually had to redo my hep B vaccine because my blood work showed that I no longer had immunity, despite having had the full series of vaccines as a child.

[NEED-A-VETTE]

Originally Posted by Giraffe

I couldn't operate one anyway. I eat like an unrestricted 7 year old.

[Steve_R]

Definitions aside, we've been told for nearly two years that it would "stop the spread" if everyone got vaccinated, then it moved to if everyone got boosted, and now there's talk of boosters every six months forever. The Covid vaccines don't stop the spread, they reduce the severity of disease in most who get them. We're still told - constantly - by the media, politicians and most medical personnel that we need to get vaxxed to stop the spread - all while the spread keeps increasing as more people get vaxxed.

Stopping the spread strongly implies that a vaxxed person can't get or transmit the virus, which has been proven to be absolutely wrong.

[Don Rickles]

George Bush's "Fool Me Once" Gaffe - YouTube

[UniqueDoug]

Originally Posted by aerovette

@UniqueDoug can illustrate better than I can. He has dictionaries dating back to the 90s that more clearly show the change.

In addition, although it was a meme, I saw a very true point made...

If I got three smallpox vaccinations in 9 months and got smallpox, I'd be asking some questions.

Whether, from a technical aspect, vaccines reduce illness or end the cycle of a virus, there is a layman's understanding for DECADES, that a vaccine's intention is to prevent a disease. No one, until Covid came along, ever challenged that notion. Why? Because it was widely accepted as true. It was not until Fauci and company, needed to defend themselves, that the definition changed and we were having the mindset revised.

Yep in 1987 a vaccine was clearly defined (by science) as a prophylactic, ie to prevent

As you move through the 90’s into 2000s that definition slowly became watered down to what we have today, with folks claiming the Covid vaccine “worked” because it lessened symptoms

If you used a prophylactic and caught only half the amount of crabs, would you say it worked? Of course not, but that’s the mentality now because science has an agenda

In a prior discussion somebody over there gave a link to a modern definition of prophylactic, so even that concept has been watered down. My speculation is science adjusted their standards so they would be wrong less.

[NEED-A-VETTE]

Originally Posted by Steve_R

Definitions aside, we've been told for nearly two years that it would "stop the spread" if everyone got vaccinated, then it moved to if everyone got boosted, and now there's talk of boosters every six months forever. The Covid vaccines don't stop the spread, they reduce the severity of disease in most who get them. We're still told - constantly - by the media, politicians and most medical personnel that we need to get vaxxed to stop the spread - all while the spread keeps increasing as more people get vaxxed.

Stopping the spread strongly implies that a vaxxed person can't get or transmit the virus, which has been proven to be absolutely wrong.

But even the phrase “stopping the spread” should have raised a red flag for evwry person that heard it. Slow the spread? Reduce the spread? Maybe. But completely “STOP the spread”? Bullshit. That doesn’t even pass the smell test.

They could repeat to me a hundred times that it would stop the spread and I would take it with a grain of salt every time. Any adult should know that vaccines are neither absolute nor foolproof. Understand that and make a risk based decision from there.

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by VITE1

The main reason is that the seasonal flu has nearly 30 active variations. They give you the vaccine for the 4 they think will be active that year. This year they got it wrong.

That is correct. Now tell me, what happened with the people that got one of the 4 correct guesses?

[Loco Vette]

Originally Posted by UniqueDoug

From the picture: 1. "Preventive: (1) preventing disease; relating to prophylaxis. 2. An agent that acts as a preventive against disease.

There is nothing in there that says a prophylactic has to be 100% effective at all times and in all circumstances to be considered a prophylactic. The only human vaccine that has managed to completely eradicate the disease it as targeted at was smallpox.

You don't get guarantees about anything, especially something as complex as the human immune system. If you want a guarantee, go see Tommy Boy.

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by NEED-A-VETTE

But even the phrase “stopping the spread” should have raised a red flag for evwry person that heard it. Slow the spread? Reduce the spread? Maybe. But completely “STOP the spread”? Bullshit. That doesn’t even pass the smell test.

They could repeat to me a hundred times that it would stop the spread and I would take it with a grain of salt every time. Any adult should know that vaccines are neither absolute nor foolproof. Understand that and make a risk based decision from there.

I, long ago, learned that most anything has some level of bullshit. There is a difference between being handed bullshit and dismissing it, and being forced to eat it, KNOWING it is bullshit.

[Aerovette]

Smokey the Bear is a damn liar.

He said "Only you can prevent forest fires" when he actually meant "Only you can reduce the magnitude of a forest fire from full devastation of 7-8 million acres, to partial devastation of 15 million acres".

[Steve_R]

Originally Posted by NEED-A-VETTE

But even the phrase “stopping the spread” should have raised a red flag for evwry person that heard it. Slow the spread? Reduce the spread? Maybe. But completely “STOP the spread”? Bullshit. That doesn’t even pass the smell test.

They could repeat to me a hundred times that it would stop the spread and I would take it with a grain of salt every time. Any adult should know that vaccines are neither absolute nor foolproof. Understand that and make a risk based decision from there.

You know that. I know that. Many know that. Unfortunately many DON'T know that and have bought into the narrative that getting vaxxed will absolutely stop the spread. How many times have our national leaders and even medical "experts" like Dr. Fauci said those words? If they admitted it will only slow it down their entire narrative about vaccine mandates and other Draconian measures would evaporate, and they can't afford to have that.

Some entire countries, like China, Australia and New Zealand have a "zero Covid" policy where they actually believe they can eradicate from an entire country and prevent every case. Yeah, good luck with that.

[Loco Vette]

Originally Posted by aerovette

Smokey the Bear is a damn liar.

He said "Only you can prevent forest fires"

He did not say "you can prevent 100% of all forest fires."

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by Loco Vette

He did not say "you can prevent 100% of all forest fires."

There is a very fuzzy definition of the word "prevent" being floated about.
This should help...

pre·vent
/prəˈvent/

verb
1. keep (something) from happening or arising.

I don't see the word "sometimes" in that definition. I don't see anything addressing frequency either. It's a pretty cut and dry definition.

[Aerovette]

I'm going to take a break for a moment and make a different point.

In case it is unclear, these discussions do not in any way impact my opinion of anyone on this forum. We are all free thinkers and all entitled to our individual opinions. Some like green beans, some don't. I don't think less of those that hate green beans. I may find it curious, but it has no impact.

This topic is very polarizing and I don't want it to polarize any forum friendships. It may be time for me to exit the discussion because I don't want the polarization. I don't want my mind closed and I don't want anyone else's closed either. I am ALWAYS responding while simultaneously considering the other perspective. It is a trait I appreciate in most every conservative I know. We will challenge our own thoughts and our own opinions while gathering information and other perspectives.

Gropehog brothers and sisters.

Let's not let this get CFOT ugly.

[Loco Vette]

Originally Posted by aerovette

There is a very fuzzy definition of the word "prevent" being floated about.
This should help...

pre·vent
/prəˈvent/

verb
1. keep (something) from happening or arising.

I don't see the word "sometimes" in that definition. I don't see anything addressing frequency either. It's a pretty cut and dry definition.

Keeping two forest fires from happening is preventing two forest fires. If lightning starts a third, it doesn't mean the first two weren't prevented.

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by Loco Vette

Keeping two forest fires from happening is preventing two forest fires. If lightning starts a third, it doesn't mean the first two werent prevented.

Hence the lie.

"Only YOU can prevent forest fires" is not true.

[Loco Vette]

Originally Posted by aerovette

Hence the lie.

"Only YOU can prevent forest fires" is not true.

Not a lie. Who else can do it, aside from humans?

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by Loco Vette

Not a lie. Who else can do it, aside from humans?

No one. They cannot be prevented.