Back the Blue, Until It Happens to You: Cop Assaults 76yo Homeowner

[slewfoot]

Originally Posted by Millenium Vette

So, by your logic, only people with fancy houses should have rights?

So, humor/sarcasm is something you don't grasp here? Anyway's going back to Bill, The Cop told him several times.

Not long before I retired and was at the office downtown, some guy was causing trouble and assaulted someone. I happened to be walking back from lunch and watched it all from maybe 15-20 ft away.

Cops are wrestling this guy trying to cuff him. Some moron driving by with apparently a dislike for police stops his car right in the busy street. He gets out and starts filming it all with his phone.

He gets in the way and they told him several times to back off. He had his chances. Finally they take him down. Suddenly we hear "Daddy, daddy!"
Stupid ass stops the car in a busy street, gets out to film and leaves his 5 year old kid in the car.

He gets hauled away and Child Protection shows up and takes the kid. Then a month later, I get stuck in a deposition over it all.

[Louie Detroit]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

If you watched the door dasher get assaulted, and truly see nothing wrong with that, I just don't know what to say. They specifically state, guy has no police record at all, so he's just like you and me.

He turned the dome light on and opened his window, things police tell us you're supposed to . He grabbed his insurance and registration to have it ready, again, something police tell us we're supposed to do. He followed the instructions, showed the hands, unlocked the door, opened it from the outside, got out, put his hands up, put his hands on his head, walked backwards, and failed at the get down on your left knee while keeping your hands on your head, a pretty decent test of balance. And they tazered him. And then, after ransacking his car and discovering that this guy is just like you and me, no criminal record, no contraband, NOTHING....they chose to arrest him anyway, after endangering his life by causing him to fall helplessly on the concrete.

Again, if you don't see anything wrong with this picture, I just have no words. It was a game of Simon says that results in torture if you get something wrong.

I’ve watched shows like COPS and OP Live for decades and don’t recall cops encouraging people to get all antsy in their cars and act in a furtive manner. What I do know cops want is for you to stay still, keep your yap shut unless spoken to and only do what they tell you to do. I haven’t been stopped in decades but if I ever am again I’m just pulling over, and then remaining motionless with my hands on the steering wheel.

I’m way too far along in life to give a fiddlers **** about stupid ****s and the shitstorms their stupidity brings down on them. Make a cops life difficult and be prepared to suffer the consequences, simple as, end of story. Encounters with the police are a test of common sense, and the dipshit losers in these cop block videos most often fail the test.

[Steve_R]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

FBI visits woman over Facebook memes:


https://twitter.com/libsoftiktok/sta...763166736?s=20

Dressed like that. No badges. No ID. Yeah, that’s credible.

[Bill]

Originally Posted by Steve_R

Dressed like that. No badges. No ID. Yeah, that’s credible.

Why shouldn't they be comfortable when they're out doing tyranny stuff?

[Millenium Vette]

Originally Posted by slewfoot

So, humor/sarcasm is something you don't grasp here? Anyway's going back to Bill, The Cop told him several times.

Not long before I retired and was at the office downtown, some guy was causing trouble and assaulted someone. I happened to be walking back from lunch and watched it all from maybe 15-20 ft away.

Cops are wrestling this guy trying to cuff him. Some moron driving by with apparently a dislike for police stops his car right in the busy street. He gets out and starts filming it all with his phone.

He gets in the way and they told him several times to back off. He had his chances. Finally they take him down. Suddenly we hear "Daddy, daddy!"
Stupid ass stops the car in a busy street, gets out to film and leaves his 5 year old kid in the car.

He gets hauled away and Child Protection shows up and takes the kid. Then a month later, I get stuck in a deposition over it all.

Hard to tell what is sarcasm/humor from you.

Difference from your story and the video is the old dude was on his own property and told the cop to leave his property, which is his perogative.

[ricks327]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

FBI visits woman over Facebook memes:


https://twitter.com/libsoftiktok/sta...763166736?s=20

After 40+ years in law enforcement and judicial system, I find it hard to believe that the 3 FBI agents wouldn't show their ID. What happened before the video started leaves a lot of questions. The other thing was the bearded guy had to look at his phone to repeat the FBI phone number.
If they were actual FBI agents, their boss should remind them to provide ID but if they showed it beforehand, showing it a 2nd time is that not difficult either.

[ricks327]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

Floyd was being contacted because he had been accused of a crime. This is nothing like that. The cop has trespassed on his property, and old guy asked the cop to leave, several times, unsuccessfully. Old guy probably shouldn't have escalated with a cop who can legally assault him at will, though.

If I read it correctly the PD was contacted that people were going door to door selling a product without a permit. If there was an ordinance to prohibit that, then that is a crime. The Sgt. being on the property investigating the alleged crime is entitled to be there. It would have been wise to have the suspects move to the street to continue the investigation. Then again, we have no idea if there had been prior issues between the old man and the PD.
Like Lou said, some people just love to create a situation with the police because of their anti-cop beliefs.

[Mick]

Originally Posted by ricks327

If I read it correctly the PD was contacted that people were going door to door selling a product without a permit. If there was an ordinance to prohibit that, then that is a crime. The Sgt. being on the property investigating the alleged crime is entitled to be there. It would have been wise to have the suspects move to the street to continue the investigation. Then again, we have no idea if there had been prior issues between the old man and the PD.
Like Lou said, some people just love to create a situation with the police because of their anti-cop beliefs.

This is, of course, the right answer. Apparently the LEO had PC on the salesmen, but not on the homeowner. Once the LEO had identified that these were the men in question, he should tell them they are detained. When the homeowner then asks the LEO to leave his property, he should have done so with the men he was detaining. LEO escalated the situation, instead of handling it professionally.

BTW, the homeowner was unquestionably a dick.

[Bill]

Originally Posted by ricks327

If I read it correctly the PD was contacted that people were going door to door selling a product without a permit. If there was an ordinance to prohibit that, then that is a crime. The Sgt. being on the property investigating the alleged crime is entitled to be there. It would have been wise to have the suspects move to the street to continue the investigation. Then again, we have no idea if there had been prior issues between the old man and the PD.
Like Lou said, some people just love to create a situation with the police because of their anti-cop beliefs.

You're saying the old guy did NOT have a right to order the police off the property? They seemed to be on his driveway, definitely curtilage. I don't understand HOW the officer had the right to NOT leave

He clearly didn't have consent to be there.

He didn't have a warrant.

So he must have had a recognized exception to the warrant requirement. What exception did he qualify for? This really doesn't seem like hot pursuit (hot pursuit of people peddling door to door without a permit?) He was driving around looking for the people, he didn't seem to have chased them to the property. Was there an emergency aid exception? Exigent circumstances? Life or property was in danger if he didn't stay on the old guy's property? What, exactly. gave him the right to stay on the curtilage of the old guy's house? If I did that, it would be trespass after warning, a crime.

I don't understand what was so compelling that the cop really had no choice but to to beat the **** out of an old man and cause him to have a heart issue, rather than, as you say, ask the peddlers to come out to the street to investigate them. He wasn't too concerned about making sure they weren't fleeing the scene, he got caught up with the property owner instead, and the old guy became his focus.

That whole scene reminded me of Michael Douglas in the movie Falling Down, when he's walking through the golf course. The old guy is gasping on the ground, asking for his pills, and Michael Douglas taunts him.....shouldn't have been a dick to me and I wouldn't have to have given you what probably was a fatal heart attack.

[Bill]

Originally Posted by Mick

This is, of course, the right answer. Apparently the LEO had PC on the salesmen, but not on the homeowner. Once the LEO had identified that these were the men in question, he should tell them they are detained. When the homeowner then asks the LEO to leave his property, he should have done so with the men he was detaining. LEO escalated the situation, instead of handling it professionally.

BTW, the homeowner was unquestionably a dick.

I would say it was reasonable, articulable suspicion, not actually probable cause. All he had at the time was a complaint from another resident or residents. He apparently didn't witness the peddlers commit any crime, the reason he didn't just walk to them and slap the cuffs on.

[ricks327]

There was reasonable belief that the two were committing a crime in the presence of the officer. The old man escalated the event. Once the old man escalated the event, the officer should have had the 2 move to the street to either cite them or arrest them, whatever the department procedure called for.

Take a common sense look at the event.
What is so offensive with a LEO standing on your driveway investigating a potential crime? The old man changed the whole event into a confrontation over a LEO standing on his property. Is this something you would do? My guess there were other contacts the old man had with the PD.
Saw many dickheads like this over 40+ years.

[donuts]

The old fella learned he ain’t taking anyones head off .. tough lesson for him. Oilton is a tiny Oklahoma town and struggle to keep a policeman on patrol.

[Millenium Vette]

Originally Posted by ricks327

There was reasonable belief that the two were committing a crime in the presence of the officer. The old man escalated the event. Once the old man escalated the event, the officer should have had the 2 move to the street to either cite them or arrest them, whatever the department procedure called for.

Take a common sense look at the event.
What is so offensive with a LEO standing on your driveway investigating a potential crime? The old man changed the whole event into a confrontation over a LEO standing on his property. Is this something you would do? My guess there were other contacts the old man had with the PD.
Saw many dickheads like this over 40+ years.

Bolded: That was his prerogative. I would absolutely not do what the old ****er did, but he wasn't wrong, legally speaking.

[cptlo306]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

...the cop really had no choice but to to beat the **** out of an old man...

Exaggerate much?

[Mick]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

I would say it was reasonable, articulable suspicion, not actually probable cause. All he had at the time was a complaint from another resident or residents. He apparently didn't witness the peddlers commit any crime, the reason he didn't just walk to them and slap the cuffs on.

No, he had more than the bolded. The LEO had already spoken to the female member of the group, so he had more information than just the citizen complaint.

I don't think it matters much, I have no problem with the officer doing his job, and RAS is good enough for me to have him investigate. But I'm pretty sure that the LEO had neither RAS nor PC on the homeowner, so when the homeowner said he wanted the LEO off his property, I'm not sure what the officer was thinking by not stepping off the property and continuing his investigation at the side of the road.

All that said, there was ZERO reason for the homeowner to threaten to physically harm the officer. This is another case of two dicks colliding out in space, and bad things happen. I do have an expectation that LEOs behave professionally when on the job, and this officer failed to do that.

[ricks327]

Originally Posted by Millenium Vette

Bolded: That was his prerogative. I would absolutely not do what the old ****er did, but he wasn't wrong, legally speaking.

For clarification, I never said the old man was wrong asking the officer to leave but he escalated the event for some unknown reason. It wasn't like the officer was beating the old man's wife.

[LATB]

That cop should have been murdered. He had no warrant and was asked many times to leave the man’s property.
**** the cop.

[GTOguy]

**** Civil Rights Lawyers. **** Slewfoot, too.

That said, 99% of the time, I side with the Police.

Not this time. The cop had no warrant and no right to physically restrain the homeowner. The cop was obligated, by law, to leave the very first time the homeowner requested it.

Interesting that this burg had no police force at all a couple month's prior.
I smell a lawsuit, but no reward as I don't think there are any assets to turn over to this old guy. (the victim)

[ThePirate]

You **** with the bull and you're going to get the horns.

[cptlo306]

Originally Posted by LATB

That cop should have been murdered. He had no warrant and was asked many times to leave the man’s property.
**** the cop.

Murdered? Really? SMDH