Mail In Ballots - Opinions ?

[MrPeabody]

Originally Posted by z06psi

You think they compare signatures on 100 million votes?

Wow. You don't know government.

I know for a fact in my county they do it on every single one of them. It takes up to a month. Even if they only checked one out of ten, that would turn up any "massive voting fraud" that everyone talks about.

I can't speak for every state, of course. In general, after ten years of working at the polls, I can tell you it's a much larger operation involving far more people than most think. I encourage anyone who can spare the time to be a poll worker at least once. It's very interesting and it will give you far more faith in the voting system than reading crap on the internet. See it first hand.

And I'm not one to automatically trust government, either. I worked for the Census ten years ago and that was a joke. Not so much fraud, but it's wildly undercounted in all categories because no one ever gets charged with not filling it out, which is technically a crime. The whole thing is unnecessary because they have other more reliable ways of counting people. It's only done to satisfy the constitutional mandate.

[VITE1]

https://www.foxnews.com/us/4-la-men-...e-da-announces

[MrPeabody]

Originally Posted by VITE1

https://www.foxnews.com/us/4-la-men-...e-da-announces

Sentences should have been much heavier. People would think twice about this crap if it was a mandatory ten years in Federal prison. Especially when it involves multiple ballots and a multi-person conspiracy.

[VITE1]

Originally Posted by MrPeabody

Sentences should have been much heavier. People would think twice about this crap if it was a mandatory ten years in Federal prison. Especially when it involves multiple ballots and a multi-person conspiracy.

As I said before make voter fraud a treasonous act and punish accordingly.

[markids77]

Originally Posted by MrPeabody

I know for a fact in my county they do it on every single one of them. It takes up to a month.

Here is my largest problem with large scale mail ins... the President's term ENDS on a fixed date; WTF do we do if the count and confirmation are unfinished at that time? Remember "hanging chads"??? I shudder to think what cluster****s would be visited if 75 or 80 percent of registered voters Nationwide mailed their votes in... and what would become of those that got misdirected only to surface in mid January??? One person, one vote guaranteed, correct? Or not?

[04 commemorative]

You should have to show voter ID and photo ID or photo drivers license period

[snide]

Originally Posted by Loco Vette

If you thought it would increase the (R) vote your opinion would be reversed.

Voter ID anyone?

That's racist!!!!

[MrPeabody]

Originally Posted by markids77

Here is my largest problem with large scale mail ins... the President's term ENDS on a fixed date; WTF do we do if the count and confirmation are unfinished at that time? Remember "hanging chads"??? I shudder to think what cluster****s would be visited if 75 or 80 percent of registered voters Nationwide mailed their votes in... and what would become of those that got misdirected only to surface in mid January??? One person, one vote guaranteed, correct? Or not?

Well, I live in a county of only 60,000 people and 3/4 of all votes here are by mail now, and they have always been counted and certified within 30 days. I would assume larger counties have a commensurate number of people to do the counting. And several states have had all mail in voting for years. For states that haven't had a lot of mail ins in the past I would think they would look to these states to see how they have been doing it. Your mail in ballot here is marked with a pen and is fed through automatic counting machines just like the live votes from the precinct.

At least with mail in ballots there is a paper trail, which you don't have with some of the older electronic machines they use at the precincts. I worry more about fraud and even honest malfunctions with the electronic stuff than I do with paper ballots, mail in or live.

[MrPeabody]

Originally Posted by 04 commemorative

You should have to show voter ID and photo ID or photo drivers license period

Of course, those can be faked, too.

And consider it is only part time poll workers scrutinizing those IDs. Would a military ID or a Student ID be acceptable? How does the average 75 year old poll worker know what a Coast Guard or other ID looks like? Military people or students don't always have an ID from the state they are temporarily residing in. How does a poll worker in Florida know what a Wyoming driver's license looks like? If the poll worker could not be sure, I suppose you could have the voter fill out a provisional ballot, but those have to be investigated by someone eventually at the Registrar's office.

I think you get my point. In principle an ID seems like a fair thing but the logistics of training poll workers to verify they are real means more training which costs money. These are all issues to be worked out. It's just not as simple as it may sound, but it should be done. Here we recently started asking for ID for any first time voter. That's a start.

[markids77]

Originally Posted by MrPeabody

Well, I live in a county of only 60,000 people and 3/4 of all votes here are by mail now, and they have always been counted and certified within 30 days. I would assume larger counties have a commensurate number of people to do the counting. And several states have had all mail in voting for years. For states that haven't had a lot of mail ins in the past I would think they would look to these states to see how they have been doing it. Your mail in ballot here is marked with a pen and is fed through automatic counting machines just like the live votes from the precinct.

At least with mail in ballots there is a paper trail, which you don't have with some of the older electronic machines they use at the precincts. I worry more about fraud and even honest malfunctions with the electronic stuff than I do with paper ballots, mail in or live.

I respect your opinion, and thank you for your civic mindedness and service to the community, and country.

However, please stop and think for a moment...about asking those States who have only yet dealt with certain early or absentee mail in balloting. Imagine if you will what herculean efforts; what human toil and cash expenditure would be required to control and audit a complete change in balloting and vote counting: to be tested, refined, equipped and staffed in LESS THAN 120 DAYS?
Georgia just changed from paperless balloting to new machinery and a paper trail to follow (for the first time) in time for the recent primaries. Google the resulting chaos... I won't do more than recommend that now: but imagine such confusion and ineptitude on a National scale and tell me you still think it is a fine idea to use this election cycle.

[markids77]

Originally Posted by MrPeabody

Of course, those can be faked, too.

And consider it is only part time poll workers scrutinizing those IDs. Would a military ID or a Student ID be acceptable? How does the average 75 year old poll worker know what a Coast Guard or other ID looks like? Military people or students don't always have an ID from the state they are temporarily residing in. How does a poll worker in Florida know what a Wyoming driver's license looks like? If the poll worker could not be sure, I suppose you could have the voter fill out a provisional ballot, but those have to be investigated by someone eventually at the Registrar's office.

I think you get my point. In principle an ID seems like a fair thing but the logistics of training poll workers to verify they are real means more training which costs money. These are all issues to be worked out. It's just not as simple as it may sound, but it should be done. Here we recently started asking for ID for any first time voter. That's a start.

Many bars I frequented in my younger years had large (and sometimes several) posters on display behind the bar showing not only current State driver's licences, but also common real and fake Military and local issue ID. Bar owners actually trained the staff to recognize fakery and report it... after refusing service to the offering underage twit. I can only assume technology, and the law, have kept pace with new developments.

[MrPeabody]

Originally Posted by markids77

Many bars I frequented in my younger years had large (and sometimes several) posters on display behind the bar showing not only current State driver's licences, but also common real and fake Military and local issue ID. Bar owners actually trained the staff to recognize fakery and report it... after refusing service to the offering underage twit. I can only assume technology, and the law, have kept pace with new developments.

Yes, back in the day I've seen booklets bar bouncers had that showed all the state driver's licenses. I'm not saying it can't be done, just that it is a big project to actually do it. And how will some people respond when some frail 75year old lady tells them their ID doesn't look right? She's no bar bouncer. And we're talking about the constitutional right of voting, not getting into a bar. Much more at stake here with the decision to call someone's ID fake. Like I said , they could go with a provisional ballot, but I can tell you some people don't react well to that.

[MrPeabody]

Originally Posted by markids77

I respect your opinion, and thank you for your civic mindedness and service to the community, and country.

However, please stop and think for a moment...about asking those States who have only yet dealt with certain early or absentee mail in balloting. Imagine if you will what herculean efforts; what human toil and cash expenditure would be required to control and audit a complete change in balloting and vote counting: to be tested, refined, equipped and staffed in LESS THAN 120 DAYS?
Georgia just changed from paperless balloting to new machinery and a paper trail to follow (for the first time) in time for the recent primaries. Google the resulting chaos... I won't do more than recommend that now: but imagine such confusion and ineptitude on a National scale and tell me you still think it is a fine idea to use this election cycle.

Well, I never said it was a "fine idea", but maybe a necessary one. I also would not like to see tens of thousands of people catch the virus by spending hours waiting in line to vote. It's a tough problem but I think there are enough smart people in every state to figure this out and do what is right for them. Right now the problem I see here is finding the typical old people that staff the precincts and are willing to take a whole new level of risk to do it again. In know I won't be doing it this time.

And thank you for the kind words and a civil conversation.

[Millenium Vette]

Originally Posted by MrPeabody

I think you get my point. In principle an ID seems like a fair thing but the logistics of training poll workers to verify they are real means more training which costs money. These are all issues to be worked out. It's just not as simple as it may sound, but it should be done. Here we recently started asking for ID for any first time voter. That's a start.

Here in Michigan they always ask for ID whenever I go in to vote and the oldsters don't seem to have problems doing it. I've also never seen a riot break out at the polling place either.

[MrPeabody]

Originally Posted by Millenium Vette

Here in Michigan they always ask for ID whenever I go in to vote and the oldsters don't seem to have problems doing it. I've also never seen a riot break out at the polling place either.

That's good to hear. Funny thing is, most people here walk up with it in their hand even tough they don't have to.

I've never had any huge problems at any polling place I worked at, but I can tell in recent years it's getting a little edgier.

[Millenium Vette]

Originally Posted by MrPeabody

That's good to hear. Funny thing is, most people here walk up with it in their hand even tough they don't have to.

I've never had any huge problems at any polling place I worked at, but I can tell in recent years it's getting a little edgier.

How do you verify a voter's identity if they don't have to show ID?

[MrPeabody]

Originally Posted by Millenium Vette

How do you verify a voter's identity if they don't have to show ID?

By address. The voter rolls are not listed by name first. They are listed by address. The first question is "What is your address?" We find that in the book then ask them their name. Sometimes it doesn't match up. Could be for various reasons, but usually they have moved without changing registration. This can lead to a provisional ballot or maybe they are at the wrong precinct. Not all county ballots are the same. If they are at the wrong precinct, our ballots could have the wrong County Supervisor candidates or the wrong school board or fire district candidates. Really the main thing is to find out if they are voting in the right place. This is the most common problem. Recently, we have been allowing voting day registration so we let then re-register then fill out a provisional ballot. That requires that they sign under penalty of perjury that the info on the registration is correct. The new registration will be investigated and the provisional ballot counted or tossed. If they are at the wrong precinct we tell them which one to go to and they deal with it there.

So without asking or showing an ID, we actually find out a lot of stuff. It's been done that way (except for same day reg.) since I've been voting starting in '72 and I don't know how long before that.

What's changed in the ten years I've been working the polls is there are a lot more provisional ballots used. Basically let the Registrar's office sort it out later rather that have a confrontation at the precinct.

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by MrPeabody

By address. The voter rolls are not listed by name first. They are listed by address. The first question is "What is your address?" We find that in the book then ask them their name. Sometimes it doesn't match up. Could be for various reasons, but usually they have moved without changing registration. This can lead to a provisional ballot or maybe they are at the wrong precinct. Not all county ballots are the same. If they are at the wrong precinct, our ballots could have the wrong County Supervisor candidates or the wrong school board or fire district candidates. Really the main thing is to find out if they are voting in the right place. This is the most common problem. Recently, we have been allowing voting day registration so we let then re-register then fill out a provisional ballot. That requires that they sign under penalty of perjury that the info on the registration is correct. The new registration will be investigated and the provisional ballot counted or tossed. If they are at the wrong precinct we tell them which one to go to and they deal with it there.

So without asking or showing an ID, we actually find out a lot of stuff. It's been done that way (except for same day reg.) since I've been voting starting in '72 and I don't know how long before that.

What's changed in the ten years I've been working the polls is there are a lot more provisional ballots used. Basically let the Registrar's office sort it out later rather that have a confrontation at the precinct.

Don't illegal aliens have an address?

[MrPeabody]

Originally Posted by aerovette

Don't illegal aliens have an address?

Maybe, but if they are not a registered voter, they won't be in the book. If someone else at that address is a registered voter, that address will be in the book, but the alien's name won't.

[Millenium Vette]

Originally Posted by MrPeabody

By address. The voter rolls are not listed by name first. They are listed by address. The first question is "What is your address?" We find that in the book then ask them their name. Sometimes it doesn't match up. Could be for various reasons, but usually they have moved without changing registration. This can lead to a provisional ballot or maybe they are at the wrong precinct. Not all county ballots are the same. If they are at the wrong precinct, our ballots could have the wrong County Supervisor candidates or the wrong school board or fire district candidates. Really the main thing is to find out if they are voting in the right place. This is the most common problem. Recently, we have been allowing voting day registration so we let then re-register then fill out a provisional ballot. That requires that they sign under penalty of perjury that the info on the registration is correct. The new registration will be investigated and the provisional ballot counted or tossed. If they are at the wrong precinct we tell them which one to go to and they deal with it there.

So without asking or showing an ID, we actually find out a lot of stuff. It's been done that way (except for same day reg.) since I've been voting starting in '72 and I don't know how long before that.

What's changed in the ten years I've been working the polls is there are a lot more provisional ballots used. Basically let the Registrar's office sort it out later rather that have a confrontation at the precinct.

No offense, but it would be real easy to cast a fraudulent vote there.