But They'll Make it Up in Volume: GM Loses $ 1.7B on EV's in ONE QUARTER

[LATB]

Originally Posted by GrandSportC3

As I said in previous posts, I'm 100% for choice and everyone should buy what works for them. However, in the next 2 decades, ICE will likely go away in the new car market.. All it takes is batteries that can travel far enough and charge far enough to overcome any down sides of EV's. There are less moving parts on the EV powertrain, requiring less maintenance. if you have a 600 mile battery that charges in 5 mins and you have sufficient charging stations, why would anyone want a new gas car that will have a lot more maintenance and a vehicle that you can't fuel at home like you can fuel an EV? I don't think that anyone needs to be forced to switch once EV's get ranges and charging time similar to gas.

We will have to agree to disagree.

I’m my case I don’t want to deal with the charging setup at my house and worse I don’t want to fool with the charging stations.

And mostly, and I can’t make this more clear…I will always drive a truck and I will never drive an electric one.

[Steve_R]

Originally Posted by GrandSportC3

In 20 years, fast chargers will be at every corner. A Tesla Supercharger costs $40000 per stall. A gas pump costs between $16k and $21k per pump, so half the price. However, the mark up on electricity is much higher, so, whoever installs them will get a better ROI. Gas stations make a minimal mark up per gallon while electricity at fast chargers is sold at 400% of the cost of electricity or even more.

Huh, you totally ignored the two questions I posed to you, so here they are again:

Originally Posted by Steve_R

- How much will it cost to install that infrastructure nationwide?
- Where will all that "new" electricity come from since that generation capacity doesn't currently exist?

[zsr22]

Originally Posted by GrandSportC3

In 20 years, fast chargers will be at every corner. A Tesla Supercharger costs $40000 per stall. A gas pump costs between $16k and $21k per pump, so half the price. However, the mark up on electricity is much higher, so, whoever installs them will get a better ROI. Gas stations make a minimal mark up per gallon while electricity at fast chargers is sold at 400% of the cost of electricity or even more.

Me thinks they won't be getting 400% when they're on every corner.

[Bill]

Originally Posted by GrandSportC3

As I said in previous posts, I'm 100% for choice and everyone should buy what works for them. However, in the next 2 decades, ICE will likely go away in the new car market.. All it takes is batteries that can travel far enough and charge far enough to overcome any down sides of EV's. There are less moving parts on the EV powertrain, requiring less maintenance. if you have a 600 mile battery that charges in 5 mins and you have sufficient charging stations, why would anyone want a new gas car that will have a lot more maintenance and a vehicle that you can't fuel at home like you can fuel an EV? I don't think that anyone needs to be forced to switch once EV's get ranges and charging time similar to gas.

YouTube

[GrandSportC3]

Originally Posted by Steve_R

Huh, you totally ignored the two questions I posed to you, so here they are again:

I already told you.. $40000 per charger
The electricity will come from the same place it came when people started having air conditioning which pulls more power than EV's will pull and EV's mostly charge at night when the grid is off peak.
The grid has grown in the past SIGNIFICANTLY and it can grow again.

I'm personally in favor of more nuclear power. Nuclear fusion is making progress and may be an option soon. We have lots of uninhabited desert areas that would be perfect for solar. All it takes is about a 100 x 100 mile area full of solar panels to power the entire country. We can use the rest of the grid to cover night use.

[dvarapala]

Originally Posted by Steve_R

And quality. Tesla is unencumbered by that as well. Even our local Tesla leg-humper admits that.

Not making excuses, but Tesla hasn't been doing this for very long and hasn't got the whole quality thing figured out completely yet.

I wonder how good the build quality was on Ford vehicles in 1910? In 100 years from now Tesla's build quality will be at least as good as Ford's.

[GrandSportC3]

Originally Posted by zsr22

Me thinks they won't be getting 400% when they're on every corner.

They won't. Prices of charging will drop as they become more widespread. However, while there are few chargers compared to gas pumps, prices will stay high. In the future, high profit will be replaced by volume.

[Steve_R]

Originally Posted by GrandSportC3

I already told you.. $40000 per charger
The electricity will come from the same place it came when people started having air conditioning which pulls more power than EV's will pull and EV's mostly charge at night when the grid is off peak.
The grid has grown in the past SIGNIFICANTLY and it can grow again.

I'm personally in favor of more nuclear power. Nuclear fusion is making progress and may be an option soon. We have lots of uninhabited desert areas that would be perfect for solar. All it takes is about a 100 x 100 mile area full of solar panels to power the entire country. We can use the rest of the grid to cover night use.

This just keeps getting better. Do you have any clue how long the entire process is from conception to hooking to the grid for a new nuclear power plant in the U.S? I don't believe you do. As for fusion, that's MANY decades away from commercial use, if it ever happens, not "soon."

[GrandSportC3]

Originally Posted by Steve_R

This just keeps getting better. Do you have any clue how long the entire process is from conception to hooking to the grid for a new nuclear power plant in the U.S? I don't believe you do. As for fusion, that's MANY decades away from commercial use, if it ever happens, not "soon."

How did the grid grow in the past? Do you think that energy production in the 1950's was what it is today?? The grid has always grown. We have several nuclear power plants that are not in service and with some repairs, they could be put back into service.

[zsr22]

Originally Posted by Steve_R

This just keeps getting better. Do you have any clue how long the entire process is from conception to hooking to the grid for a new nuclear power plant in the U.S? I don't believe you do. As for fusion, that's MANY decades away from commercial use, if it ever happens, not "soon."

Everything is 20 years away. Why can't you just accept that?

[dvarapala]

Originally Posted by GrandSportC3

Nobody here on this forum has ever suggested to BAN gas cars.

Some folks feel threatened by change, especially when it comes to cars. If you mention self-driving vehicles they immediately assume that human-driven vehicles will be banned. If you mention EVs they immediately assume that ICE vehicles will be banned. They then go off on a rant about how they'll have to pry those steering wheels "out of my cold, dead hands."

But pointing out that bans don't exist now nor have they even been proposed does no good, because these folks just KNOW that there is a secret evil conspiracy that is even now plotting to ban those cars, it just hasn't been announced yet.

[TheHammer]

The government cant' even get internet to every corner of the country for the last 20 years, and we're to believe they'll build a charger network across the country in short order?

[Onebadcad]

Originally Posted by Steve_R

Huh, you totally ignored the two questions I posed to you, so here they are again:

I believe another good question to ask is when will ALL EV OWNERS retroactively send in their total payments for all the years of ownership in which they evaded the gasoline tax that all others have already paid.
I think $1,200/year for all years owned is a good start.

Then I need to come up with a number for the disposal of their cars after ten years of usage, as those used and useless batteries will be costly to society.

[Aerovette]

EVs are just the mopeds of today. A fad that won't endure.

[Steve_R]

Originally Posted by GrandSportC3

How did the grid grow in the past? Do you think that energy production in the 1950's was what it is today?? The grid has always grown. We have several nuclear power plants that are not in service and with some repairs, they could be put back into service.

How did it grow decades ago? Largely unregulated coal, oil and gas plants. Those times are long gone. Which nuclear plants are not in service that can be put back into service with "some repairs?" I can't wait for that answer.

You have no clue how overregulated electric generation facilities are in this country, especially nuclear plants.

[Bill]

Originally Posted by dvarapala

Some folks feel threatened by change, especially when it comes to cars. If you mention self-driving vehicles they immediately assume that human-driven vehicles will be banned. If you mention EVs they immediately assume that ICE vehicles will be banned. They then go off on a rant about how they'll have to pry those steering wheels "out of my cold, dead hands."

But pointing out that bans don't exist now nor have they even been proposed does no good, because these folks just KNOW that there is a secret evil conspiracy that is even now plotting to ban those cars, it just hasn't been announced yet.

To be fair, look at all the "conspiracy theories" that are now proven true.

How about "the great replacement theory" where Whites will be replaced by non Whites. Have you looked at Western Europe lately? Looked around the US? It's not the same US you grew up with, and it is RAPIDLY replacing now.

And as Oprah famously noted, people like most of us, older White people....."they just have to die."

How about all the civil libertarians like me that warned against the "Patriot Act?" Turns out we were correct about the surveillance state spying on every single American, and without a warrant and probable cause. Ed Snowden is stuck in Russia because your government, instead of punishing the criminals in our own government, punished the guy who pointed out that criminality, kind of like homegirl Fani in Fulton County, GA firing the employee who pointed out another employee was going to scam government money for the employee's personal business. Who got fired and marched out? The whistleblower.

So when we tell you this push to electric is part and parcel of pushing for 15 minute cities, and controlling the movement of the people, consider we've been right about just about everything else so far. Vegas would give us pretty good odds of being right about this, too. Oh, and the WEF/globalists freely admit it, there's that, too. They're admitting it now because they believe their plans can no longer be stopped.

[GrandSportC3]

Originally Posted by zsr22

Everything is 20 years away. Why can't you just accept that?

We won't go from 6% EV to 100% EV in 2 years. It willl take time as well. Grid will grow at the speed as demand grows. It always has.

[DJ_Critterus]

Originally Posted by Onebadcad

There is a dood in here with a Bolt, he has documented proof that you always get laid if you own a Bolt.
He once had a threesome set up, but ran out of room, so cut it back to a onesome.
I may be buying one soon, or not.

If my Bolt's-a-rockin don't come a-knockin

[GrandSportC3]

Originally Posted by Steve_R

How did it grow decades ago? Largely unregulated coal, oil and gas plants. Those times are long gone. Which nuclear plants are not in service that can be put back into service with "some repairs?" I can't wait for that answer.

You have no clue how overregulated electric generation facilities are in this country, especially nuclear plants.

Overregulation is an issue that has to be solved. When it comes to energy production, I suppprt all the above. As I pointed out, during daytime, a 100 x 100 mile area in a desert with solar panels would be sufficient to supply all of the US during daytime. We have tons of uninhabited areas where you could have solar.

[Steve_R]

Originally Posted by GrandSportC3

Overregulation is an issue that has to be solved. When it comes to energy production, I suppprt all the above. As I pointed out, during daytime, a 100 x 100 mile area in a desert with solar panels would be sufficient to supply all of the US during daytime. We have tons of uninhabited areas where you could have solar.

You can't really be that naive. The fed gov is making more and more of that desert land off limits to almost anything, yet we should supply power to the entire country from one giant solar plant.

I'm still waiting on your answer to this question: Which nuclear plants are not in service that can be put back into service with "some repairs?"