The Empire Strikes Back: Israeli Missiles hit Iran

[vettemed]

Originally Posted by Bruze

What was a huge factor in the collapsing of many global empires throughout history?

Fighting "endless foreign wars," and debasing the currency to pay for them -- i.e. inflation. Sound familiar?

Nixon really kicked it off in 1971 by delinking the dollar from gold, to help pay for the Vietnam War. The inflation (by .gov controlling the money supply) has been ongoing since (it was before that too, just not as bad).

I'd love to put all this current mess on Biden's shoulders, but it's a century-long problem. The problem is government, not which "team" happens to be running it.

Being not too distantly related to Chimps and Bonobos, we humans have an innate tendency to fight. As humankind has developed technology, that fighting is ever more expensive.

Amassing tax dollars allows the chimps running the show to flex their monkey muscles at the chimps somewhere else.

[6spdC6]

Originally Posted by Vette40th

Biden and Obama have been working this war for some time. FJB
I dont want another fricking war.
On a side note, Its the regime in Iran, that we should have taken out in 79

So many problems caused by Jimmy Carter, but this was probably his biggest. Not backing the Shaw was bad enough but by allowing the Ayatollah Kommini to come back to Iran was the worst. With the equipment and knowledge the CIA has, a fatal heart attack or a very fast moving disease could have taken out that POS. Repeat he never should have got out of prison alive.

[ptindall]

Originally Posted by Swany00

amazing foreign policy....russia attacks ukraine, America screws allies in afghanistan withdrawal, America funds terrorists with weapons and billions of dollars, we provide hundreds of millions for other countries borders yet allow our own borders to be invaded, china threatening taiwan...the list goes on how much this ****ing potato has compromised the USA...**** him and his ilk

Just imagine how ****ed up everything would get if we adobted Bill Daniels style isolationism by pulling American forces out of everywhere and declaring that we aren't helping any of our allies at all.

[Onebadcad]

Hopefully glass becomes cheaper,,,

[BRUIZER]

Originally Posted by 6spdC6

So many problems caused by Jimmy Carter, but this was probably his biggest. Not backing the Shaw was bad enough but by allowing the Ayatollah Kommini to come back to Iran was the worst. With the equipment and knowledge the CIA has, a fatal heart attack or a very fast moving disease could have taken out that POS. Repeat he never should have got out of prison alive.

The agency mentioned above far FAR underestimated the
islamic movement at that time. The mullah's were utilizing university students to protest violently. Once the US, who was monitoring the situation realized the strength of the movement it was already to late.
Failed intelligence 100%. Or intentional?

[Bruze]

Originally Posted by ptindall

Just imagine how ****ed up everything would get if we adobted Bill Daniels style isolationism by pulling American forces out of everywhere and declaring that we aren't helping any of our allies at all.

There's a WHOLE LOT of real estate between being a global military empire and "isolationism" -- a term made up by the militant left to smear people who are tired of the never-ending and very expensive meddling overseas.

It's all clever propaganda: They have Americans believing that there are only two sides to foreign "aid": Be a global military empire or completely retract from everything. Pick a side, there is no middle ground.

The Founding Fathers were well aware of this problem; these were not stupid men. George Washington had these sentiments, and Thomas Jefferson (3rd president) said in his inaugural address in 1801:

"Peace, commerce and honest friendship with all nations, entangling alliances with none."

That is, maybe, just an ideal to hold, but it has been long abandoned in favor of global power -- and we are paying for it all.

[6spdC6]

Originally Posted by BRUIZER

The agency mentioned above far FAR underestimated the
islamic movement at that time. The mullah's were utilizing university students to protest violently. Once the US, who was monitoring the situation realized the strength of the movement it was already to late.

Failed intelligence 100%. Or intentional?

Many times on a lot of subjects that crosses my mind!

[Bruze]

Originally Posted by vettemed

Being not too distantly related to Chimps and Bonobos, we humans have an innate tendency to fight. As humankind has developed technology, that fighting is ever more expensive.

Amassing tax dollars allows the chimps running the show to flex their monkey muscles at the chimps somewhere else.

It's the institution of government that brings all this out, concentrates and empowers the worst traits of mankind, and makes possible the annihilation of entire populations.

Me, nor anyone else I know, has any interest in having enough power to wipe out entire populations. Those desires are only possible to achieve through the vehicle of government.

[ptindall]

Originally Posted by Bruze

It's all clever propaganda: They have Americans believing that there are only two sides to foreign "aid": Be a global military empire or completely retract from everything. Pick a side, there is no middle ground.

I guess you don't read Bill Daniels posts where he says to completely retract from everything.

[slewfoot]

Originally Posted by LATB

Trump was brokering peace deals in the Middle East.
Biden wants war.

Yeh and at the same time, sucking on his Dictator buds, Putin and Kim Jong-Un

[Bruze]

Originally Posted by ptindall

I guess you don't read Bill Daniels posts where he says to completely retract from everything.

No I don't read most of his posts, but the idea of "isolationism" as a propaganda tool used by the "Big War" people isn't new.

I remember the Big War crowd throwing the term at Pat Buchanan some 30 years ago.

[Bruze]

Supposedly the White House is contemplating declaring a "climate change emergency" at some point before the election, which would empower the president with broad war powers unobtainable by any other "emergency." And of course those powers will be used against us -- which is the whole point.

If this isn't the pre-election "Black Swan Event," then it will be something else.

[ptindall]

Originally Posted by Bruze

No I don't read most of his posts, but the idea of "isolationism" as a propaganda tool used by the "Big War" people isn't new.

I remember the Big War crowd throwing the term at Pat Buchanan some 30 years ago.

So you don't like that the term exists at all, even though it conveys a particular foreign policy standpoint that we all generally understand? What term do you prefer to use for someone with that viewpoint?

[ptindall]

Originally Posted by Bruze

Supposedly the White House is contemplating declaring a "climate change emergency" at some point before the election, which would empower the president with broad war powers unobtainable by any other "emergency." And of course those powers will be used against us -- which is the whole point.

Sure. And what do you estimate are the chances that will actually come to pass?

[Vette40th]

All of this is intentional. CIA has been an entity, ie cancer, that has taken over countries for decades. They have been rehired by Europe to crush the USA.

[Steve_R]

Originally Posted by slewfoot

Yeh and at the same time, sucking on his Dictator buds, Putin and Kim Jong-Un

Your TDS appears to be severe. See a physician ASAP.

[Onebadcad]

Originally Posted by slewfoot

Yeh and at the same time, sucking on his Dictator buds, Putin and Kim Jong-Un

Thanks again for proving the point.

rocketboy has been a thorn in the USA for over a decade.

ALL here want a brokered peace, they want the threat to go away.

EVERYONE HAS FAILED, HE CONTINUES TO BE AN AHOLE, AND A MAJOR THREAT.

TRUMP does the best he can, takes it closer than anyone before or after him.

And your ilk now makes fun of it.

EPITOME of having it both ways!!

[Kevin68]

Originally Posted by Bruze

Nixon really kicked it off in 1971 by delinking the dollar from gold, to help pay for the Vietnam War. The inflation (by .gov controlling the money supply) has been ongoing since (it was before that too, just not as bad).

Nixon's action was for sure a tipping point, but don't forget that 38 years earlier FDR forced people to turn in their gold for pieces of paper so he could print more money for his pet projects. Now, they don't even bother trying to justify their expenditures; just crank up the printing presses and pass the money around.

[Bill]

Originally Posted by ptindall

Just imagine how ****ed up everything would get if we adobted Bill Daniels style isolationism by pulling American forces out of everywhere and declaring that we aren't helping any of our allies at all.

Well, just off the top of my head, the Ukraine has NEVER been an ally of the US, so I don't understand why we're funding the killing of White people over there. If you haven't noticed, Whites are a global minority and under attack in almost every homeland they occupy.

And if we're looking at allies, I'd say an important metric is, do the countries that are presumably allies send their kids to die for each other's wars. After we deposed Saddam, after previously supporting him against Iran, then paying James Biden to rebuild the country, is Iraq an ally, or is Iraq just a money pit?

How about Syria? Why did those 4 soldiers from Georgia have to die there? What were they doing there in the first place? And as far as Israel/Gaza.....it's a weird ally relationship where the US borrows money to send to Israel, yet, I can't recall even one time where Israel sent soldiers and war materiel to help us fight OUR wars. Is there something I missed?

Bottom line is, we should have heeded George Washington, who made the reasonable case that America should become strong and independent, and avoid permanent foreign entanglements.

As far as our forward military presence......we could close half the overseas bases, BRAC, repatriate those operations here, and have our southern border defended and shut down tighter than a dick's hatband and still be more well positioned than China/Iran/North Korea/Russia combined. Bonus that all the money that supports those foreign bases would now be spent in America, those dollars would circulate in OUR economy, not the economies of other countries, many of whom don't even like us.

Beyond all that, we're a broke nation. We can no longer afford the yuge foreign footprint by our military. At some point pulling back won't be an option, it will just happen on its own, just like the USSR collapse.

So, modest orderly draw down now, or a redux of the Afghanistan withdrawal on a larger scale? Pick one.



Edit: And with that, I'm going to kermie my own post and request this get moved to PR&C, to honor the spirit of Rob's request.

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by Bill

Well, just off the top of my head, the Ukraine has NEVER been an ally of the US, so I don't understand why we're funding the killing of White people over there. If you haven't noticed, Whites are a global minority and under attack in almost every homeland they occupy.

And if we're looking at allies, I'd say an important metric is, do the countries that are presumably allies send their kids to die for each other's wars. After we deposed Saddam, after previously supporting him against Iran, then paying James Biden to rebuild the country, is Iraq an ally, or is Iraq just a money pit?

How about Syria? Why did those 4 soldiers from Georgia have to die there? What were they doing there in the first place? And as far as Israel/Gaza.....it's a weird ally relationship where the US borrows money to send to Israel, yet, I can't recall even one time where Israel sent soldiers and war materiel to help us fight OUR wars. Is there something I missed?

Bottom line is, we should have heeded George Washington, who made the reasonable case that America should become strong and independent, and avoid permanent foreign entanglements.

As far as our forward military presence......we could close half the overseas bases, BRAC, repatriate those operations here, and have our southern border defended and shut down tighter than a dick's hatband and still be more well positioned than China/Iran/North Korea/Russia combined. Bonus that all the money that supports those foreign bases would now be spent in America, those dollars would circulate in OUR economy, not the economies of other countries, many of whom don't even like us.

Beyond all that, we're a broke nation. We can no longer afford the yuge foreign footprint by our military. At some point pulling back won't be an option, it will just happen on its own, just like the USSR collapse.

So, modest orderly draw down now, or a redux of the Afghanistan withdrawal on a larger scale? Pick one.



Edit: And with that, I'm going to kermie my own post and request this get moved to PR&C, to honor the spirit of Rob's request.

Agree.

As for the bold part, remember, the Dems think Trump loves Russia so of course they will throw every dollar at an effort to attack a friend of Trump's.