School me on narrowband vs. wideband

[Sneaks]

Someone school me on the differences, and parts needed, between a narrowband and a wideband. I have no clue as to the differences and need some information.
Thanks Barn folks!

[Y2Kvert4me]

Narrowband (ie; stock) 02 sensors work on a 0-1v scale, and are only intended to function accurately at or very near stoich (14.7:1 afr). This is the afr value your PCM is always trying to maintain in normal, "closed loop" engine operation.

When you go WOT and/or high RPM, your PCM enriches, or adds additional fuel to lower combustion chamber temps, and essentially, protect the engine from burning itself up while it's being pushed hard. It will run as rich as 12-13:1 during these conditions, and the stock narrowband cannot report afr accurately in those conditions, so this is when they are cut out of the loop (open loop), and the PCM does not monitor 02 sensor input during those times.


Wideband sensors function on a 0-5v scale, and can be quite accurate in the much "wider" range of 10:1 to 20:1 afr.
So, this is why wideband sensors have become popular for tuning purposes, because you can accurately measure actual afr during ALL operating conditions, which the stock narrowband sensors are incapable of doing.

And since I don't know WHY you're asking the question, I will say this. No, a wideband sensor will not connect or work with your PCM. They are generally only used in standalone applications independent of the PCM, such as a gauge, or tuning software input.
There are some wideband controller systems which can also simulate a narrowband output, for the primary reason you can run the wideband system, yet physically put the sensor in place of one of your stock sensors, and still send a correct narrowband signal output to the PCM to replicate the missing narrowband sensor.

This is the simplified answer. You can ask more specific questions from here, depending on why you're asking and what you wish to do.

[MYSCZ06]

yup what he said!

[WKMCD]

Well said.

I run a PLX WB and an AFR gauge and simulate NB to the PCM. Works well.

I idle in SD and go CL off idle.

[Y2Kvert4me]

Originally Posted by WKMCD

I idle in SD and go CL off idle.

How are you switching the MAF on and off?

SD = Speed Density = no MAF used for airmass calculations, nothing much ado about CL/OL, which refers to 02 input and fuel trims.

[Sneaks]

Now that's good info Y2K! I picked up a 2 gauge A-pillar pod. I want to run 2 gauges, one for fuel pressure, and one for AF ratio, for when I install the N20. Trying to keep the system safe as possible.

[Y2Kvert4me]

Originally Posted by Sneaks

Now that's good info Y2K! I picked up a 2 gauge A-pillar pod. I want to run 2 gauges, one for fuel pressure, and one for AF ratio, for when I install the N20. Trying to keep the system safe as possible.

If you buy just a wideband gauge kit, it will likely come with it's own 02 sensor. Which means that sensor has to screw into the exhaust somewhere.
If your current configuration is using all 4 stock sensors, you'd have to weld in a threaded bung for the additional wideband sensor somewhere upstream of the cats. (the gauge/sensor kit will probably include the bung fitting).
Just so you know what you're in for...you will probably be dropping the exhaust or a header to get this done.

If you bought a PLX controller kit and optional gauge, then you could do exactly as Kevin has...Replace one of your stock front 02 sensors with the wideband, and use the narrowband output of the controller to connect to your PCM, but it will take some wire splicing to do so.
And the added benefit too, if you ever get your own tuning software, you'll be quite ready to connect the wideband data to it.

PLX is not the only system that does this, but I'm not really brushed up on specs of the other brands to say which others do for sure. I use a PLX too FWIW.

[Munch]

Damn, missed this thread somehow. Anyway, I have a couple questions too.

1. If you go lean under boost and you see your gauge and let off the throttle, isn't it already too late?

2. Would it be safer to have a wideband for each bank or is that just overkill?

[Eagleeye]

Some racers use one wide band and also up to 8 EGT sensors to monitor each cylinder...especially if carburated

[edcmat-l1]

Originally Posted by WKMCD

Well said.

I run a PLX WB and an AFR gauge and simulate NB to the PCM. Works well.

I idle in SD and go CL off idle.

Originally Posted by Y2Kvert4me

How are you switching the MAF on and off?

SD = Speed Density = no MAF used for airmass calculations, nothing much ado about CL/OL, which refers to 02 input and fuel trims.

Open loop idle......