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Old 08-01-2015, 10:35am   #1
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Default Navy officer to face charges for returning fire during terrorist attack here

If the information just posted on allenbwest.com is correct the DOD has decided to bring charges against Navy officer Lt. Cmdr Timothy White for using his personal firearm to engage the terrorist that was shooting at other servicemen at the naval reserve here in Chattanooga Glass last month. Lt. White violated a DOD directive by possessing a firearm on a military installation. Never mind that his actions likely saved many lives and limited the casualities inflicted by the "lone gunman" (i. e. crazed Muslim).
This is horse shit. The man deserves a commendation, not his career ruined.

Cannot link it from my phone but will post it later when I get home.
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Old 08-01-2015, 10:48am   #2
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Our so called .gov is SO effed up, it's pathetic.....and with ACORN rigging the vote scanners....I hold no hope.....
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Old 08-01-2015, 10:55am   #3
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I was just going to post this. This .gov is insane.
Words fail me....
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Old 08-01-2015, 11:18am   #4
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Haven't seen it from a non-propaganda news outlet yet.
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Old 08-01-2015, 11:36am   #5
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It is not rational how the .gov is. They tell the .mil crowd what huge targets we are, yet turn around and tell us we are not competent enough to carry our own firearms. Just wait on security forces or the police. I call bullshit, and so does everyone I know. I can be shot at by some crazy sumbitch, but can't return fire. Complete load of BS. And unfortunately, the Navy guy is probably going to be burned at the stake because of the ridiculous politics. To say it pisses me off is an understatement.... Maybe the sorry pieces of crap that make these rules and or enforce them should be without protection. Starting at the top. No more Presidential security. After all, shouldn't people be nice????
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Old 08-01-2015, 11:42am   #6
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Did you ever notice that the people that want to keep everybody defenseless are ALWAYS well protected by ARMED security? Paid for by US!
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Old 08-01-2015, 11:47am   #7
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If true, I'd like to be a member of that court martial.

There was a time I would have said no jury would convict him. Not so sure today.
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Old 08-01-2015, 11:53am   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broken Wind View Post
If true, I'd like to be a member of that court martial.

There was a time I would have said no jury would convict him. Not so sure today.
If it is true, then everyone here should be on the phone to their congressman/woman come Monday morning demanding the LtCdr get a medal, not a Captain's Mast. It is time for us to put up or shut up. This guy is a hero for limiting potentially many more lives lost.
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Old 08-02-2015, 8:17am   #9
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For some reason just about everything the military and law enforcement do these days is Monday morning quarterbacked until they can find enough reason to hang the good guys. Problem is good guys don't fight back as a group while the bad guys do, and they know they won't be publically criticized. The inmates have taken over the asylum.
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Old 08-02-2015, 8:41am   #10
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I've seen this in several news reports. America should b embarrassed by this and other actions taken by our government.
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Old 08-02-2015, 9:13am   #11
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He should get a medal and a promotion.
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Old 08-02-2015, 9:39am   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VITE1 View Post
I've seen this in several news reports. America should b embarrassed by this and other actions taken by our government.



Stupid cock suckers need to wake up and see the real world..

It shames me to think we let these lame fags take over to rule..

They should be giving the guy an award..
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Old 08-02-2015, 4:11pm   #13
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I agree 100% that was he did was heroic and probably saved lives. I also agree that the policy is beyond stupid. If it wasn't you wouldn't have National Guard offices telling their people to arm up.

However, being a 19 year veteran I do feel he should be punished. He was given a direct order, which he chose to violate. The order was stupid, but it was lawful. He made a decision to violate the order and should be punished accordingly.

I just spent the last 6 years as a First Sergeant advising commanders on just this kind of issue. If I was standing in my CC's office, my advice would be Article 15 punishment or possible Court Martial.

I did see an earlier comment urging people to call their Congressmen. However, this is the last thing the military justice system needs. We have rules and a process in place and the last thing the process needs is a bunch of politicians sticking their noses into it. This is precisely the reason the military justice system is so messed up when it comes to sexual assault. The system was working and then the politics got involved. Now we have Commanders afraid to lead and make decisions based on politics instead of what's right for the member, the squadron and the Air Force.
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Old 08-02-2015, 4:30pm   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NavyC5 View Post
I agree 100% that was he did was heroic and probably saved lives. I also agree that the policy is beyond stupid. If it wasn't you wouldn't have National Guard offices telling their people to arm up.

However, being a 19 year veteran I do feel he should be punished. He was given a direct order, which he chose to violate. The order was stupid, but it was lawful. He made a decision to violate the order and should be punished accordingly.

I just spent the last 6 years as a First Sergeant advising commanders on just this kind of issue. If I was standing in my CC's office, my advice would be Article 15 punishment or possible Court Martial.

I did see an earlier comment urging people to call their Congressmen. However, this is the last thing the military justice system needs. We have rules and a process in place and the last thing the process needs is a bunch of politicians sticking their noses into it. This is precisely the reason the military justice system is so messed up when it comes to sexual assault. The system was working and then the politics got involved. Now we have Commanders afraid to lead and make decisions based on politics instead of what's right for the member, the squadron and the Air Force.
I agree with the second 1/2 of your statement, but I have a problem with him being charged for using common sense in 'failure to follow STUPID orders'.......and I don't give a shit about the political crap, those 'orders' are STOOOOOOOOOPID!!!!!! and all else is bullshit!!!!!!


F*CK the poly-ticks.......



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Old 08-02-2015, 4:55pm   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrvette View Post
I agree with the second 1/2 of your statement, but I have a problem with him being charged for using common sense in 'failure to follow STUPID orders'.......and I don't give a shit about the political crap, those 'orders' are STOOOOOOOOOPID!!!!!! and all else is bullshit!!!!!!


F*CK the poly-ticks.......



I agree 100% that the order was stupid. That's why you work to get the rule changed, you don't arbitrarily decide to violate it. That's not how the military works. I have to follow orders every day that I think are stupid, what do I do. I work to change the ones I can, and follow the ones I can't. That's how being in the military works. Those of us in the chain of command follow the orders of those appointed over us. If we don't, the process fails.
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Old 08-02-2015, 5:07pm   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NavyC5 View Post
I agree 100% that the order was stupid. That's why you work to get the rule changed, you don't arbitrarily decide to violate it. That's not how the military works. I have to follow orders every day that I think are stupid, what do I do. I work to change the ones I can, and follow the ones I can't. That's how being in the military works. Those of us in the chain of command follow the orders of those appointed over us. If we don't, the process fails.


I'd have to argue that forcibly disarming our troops when we are "at war" with terror is an illegal order, and thus should not be followed. Failing that, if there is a court martial, I only have two words....jury nullification.
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Old 08-02-2015, 5:25pm   #17
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NavyC5 is spot on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_daniels View Post
I'd have to argue that forcibly disarming our troops when we are "at war" with terror is an illegal order, and thus should not be followed. Failing that, if there is a court martial, I only have two words....jury nullification.
Ummmmm yea, that's not quite how it works. It's a rule that you (and I) don't like. That doesn't make it illegal and it doesn't mean you just say f**k it and do what you want instead.

LCDR made a choice. He will face the consequences of that choice. He knew the rules, as does anybody who serves. He willfully broke them.

I highly suspect he will hold his head high throughout the disciplinary process to come.

I don't agree with this rule at all, never did. I hope this highlights it and takes us closer to changing it.
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Old 08-02-2015, 6:50pm   #18
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Since every member of the military is issued a weapon and trained in the use thereof I have to wonder why every one who is wearing their uniform is not also wearing their weapon? It has become glaringly obvious that terror is indeed a Worldwide problem so it seems irresponsible of the commanders to allow their people t go about without the means to fight.
IDGAS if the sheeple might find the sight of M4s in public disturbing...we are indeed at war and should be prepared at all times!
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Old 08-02-2015, 6:58pm   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markids77 View Post
Since every member of the military is issued a weapon and trained in the use thereof I have to wonder why every one who is wearing their uniform is not also wearing their weapon? It has become glaringly obvious that terror is indeed a Worldwide problem so it seems irresponsible of the commanders to allow their people t go about without the means to fight.
IDGAS if the sheeple might find the sight of M4s in public disturbing...we are indeed at war and should be prepared at all times!
I would feel a lot better having the folks who are responsible for keeping our country safe having loaded weapons on them at all times.

Are they to act as English Bobbies yelling "Stop or I'll yell stop again" ?
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Old 08-02-2015, 7:05pm   #20
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No offense to the serving military members here, but blindly obeying bad orders got us the fun of Hitler's European tour. Frankly I don't know how anyone could serve under the Kenyan CS, and I hope you decide to disobey when he decides to declare martial law and tells you to shoot guys like me and crazy Gene...
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