the Fairness in Taxation Act

[Broken Wind]

Originally Posted by ChasC5

Your full of Shit, the wealthy Taxes hasn't gone up in a decade.

Neither has anyone else's if they stayed in the same marginal bracket all those years. My taxes went up because my earnings have increased...tremendously...over the past decade. I'm not complaining.

[Peter Pan]

Originally Posted by ChasC5

Your full of Shit, the wealthy Taxes hasn't gone up in a decade, but I bet yours did! Stop sucking the tit of people who wouldn't piss on you if you were in fire.

My income went up under Clinton and Bush, under Nobama it has decreased so I am for the first time since leaving the military paying less in taxes, my tax rate has decreased. Again you do not know chit, make more and pay more, make less and pay less or if it continues to fall I will pay none and I sure hope this does not happen

Originally Posted by Broken Wind

Neither has anyone else's if they stayed in the same marginal bracket all those years. My taxes went up because my earnings have increased...tremendously...over the past decade. I'm not complaining.

My income was going North before the change in the white house, not I am paying less in taxes and my rate went down, I would like to make more but the Nobama admin cut independents pay in half, so I have taken another hit from Nobama as I am not a union or govt worker

[Bill]

Originally Posted by Z06PDQ

even if you taxed the 47% we will fall short. it's time for the big boys to step up.

That is still no excuse for them NOT to pay. I pay, you pay, Peter pays.....why can't they pay? And for that matter, why must I pay extra so many of those 47% can get an E.I.T.C. gift courtesy of the taxpayers every April 15?

That E.I.T.C. "gift" probably wipes out whatever that 47% may have paid into SS and Med.

[Z06PDQ]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

That is still no excuse for them NOT to pay. I pay, you pay, Peter pays.....why can't they pay? And for that matter, why must I pay extra so many of those 47% can get an E.I.T.C. gift courtesy of the taxpayers every April 15?

That E.I.T.C. "gift" probably wipes out whatever that 47% may have paid into SS and Med.

where have you been? most of them can't even make the rent. they live paycheck to paycheck & are one disaster away from financial ruin.if these people were given the opportunities the top 5% have the last 30 years they would be able to pay. that's why it's called "FAIRNESS" in taxation.

[ChasC5]

Originally Posted by Broken Wind

Neither has anyone else's if they stayed in the same marginal bracket all those years. My taxes went up because my earnings have increased...tremendously...over the past decade. I'm not complaining.

The benefit of the many outweigh the benefit of the few ... always have been.

This is still a America

[Peter Pan]

Originally Posted by Z06PDQ

where have you been? most of them can't even make the rent. they live paycheck to paycheck & are one disaster away from financial ruin.if these people were given the opportunities the top 5% have the last 30 years they would be able to pay. that's why it's called "FAIRNESS" in taxation.

Very lame, time to get those 47% not paying any income taxes on the rolls that are not in poverty, I was not put on earth to take care of them unless it is of my free choosing and I am taxed enough already to support those freebies

[Z06PDQ]

Originally Posted by mrvette

cut skool bud gets by 50% also.....

colleges and universities teach hard science/engineering and business/econ/finance......maybe con law....that's IT.....

no more sociology, psych, englush, literature, philosophy, and other ass or ted silliness.......

stone seriously....

[Bill]

Originally Posted by Z06PDQ

where have you been? most of them can't even make the rent. they live paycheck to paycheck & are one disaster away from financial ruin.if these people were given the opportunities the top 5% have the last 30 years they would be able to pay. that's why it's called "FAIRNESS" in taxation.

There are people at many levels of the economic spectrum that live paycheck to paycheck. Just because you are a poor manager of money doesn't mean you should get a free ride when it comes to taxes.

What did we do when we were in college? Yeah, we had roomates to split expenses. What do Asian and Hispanic immigrants do (both legal and illegal)? Yeah, they live 15 people to a house, with each adult working and contributing. They make it work, why can't everyone else do the same?

Here's the thing....whether we collect a minimum tax from people who are poor stewards of money or not, they are still going to have money problems because....they are poor stewards of money.

Uncle Sam should be just like the Mob in this regard, he needs to get his cut first, and then folks can figure out how to survive on the rest.

[ChasC5]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

There are people at many levels of the economic spectrum that live paycheck to paycheck. Just because you are a poor manager of money doesn't mean you should get a free ride when it comes to taxes.

This accurately describes a Republican mind to a tee … paint everyone with a broad brush. This is precisely why they are angry and bitter and their world is getting so small that they will soon become extinct. There are hundreds to thousands of American Citizens who are living, through no fault of their own, check to check. Starting in 2008, the entire world economic structure went through the worst recession since the Great Depression. Or did everyone forget that already?

[Z06PDQ]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

Uncle Sam should be just like the Mob in this regard, he needs to get his cut first, and then folks can figure out how to survive on the rest.

so much for "reducing the size & impact" of government.

[Bill]

Originally Posted by ChasC5

This accurately describes a Republican mind to a tee … paint everyone with a broad brush. This is precisely why they are angry and bitter and their world is getting so small that they will soon become extinct. There are hundreds to thousands of American Citizens who are living, through no fault of their own, check to check. Starting in 2008, the entire world economic structure went through the worst recession since the Great Depression. Or did everyone forget that already?

I can't speak for Republicans, 'cause I aren't one.

Hey, life sucks sometimes, even if it isn't our own fault, and many times when it is our fault. Go back and reread my post. What do broke people do? They move in together to share expenses. Oh, Mary has no job? Fine. She can watch the kids of Betty, Suzy and Pam while Betty, Suzy and Pam go off to work at their crappy low paying jobs. Everybody contributes. That's the way it goes. I once had 5 people living in my one bedroom apartment to make ends meet.

Guess what? Even back then, I still paid a little bit of Federal Income Tax. Why can't Americans today do that?

If Mary doesn't like the situation, she can find a job, make some money, and move out. If Betty, Suzy and Pam hate their jobs, they too can be looking for another, better job, while they work their crappy jobs to pay the bills. This is what personal responsibility looks like.

And this also begs the question, pre-2008, before the recession, why didn't Mary, Betty, Suzy and Pam save some money for a rainy day? Why didn't they live BELOW their means, knowing that bad times may come one day? Why is their lack of planning MY fault?

Originally Posted by Z06PDQ

so much for "reducing the size & impact" of government.

Making everyone contribute to government by paying SOME income tax is not mutually exclusive with smaller government. In fact, smaller government benefits pretty much everyone NOT on the government teat by bringing us closer to a balanced budget, creating less future debt for Americans.

[ChasC5]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

I can't speak for Republicans, 'cause I aren't one.

Hey, life sucks sometimes, even if it isn't our own fault, and many times when it is our fault. Go back and reread my post. What do broke people do? They move in together to share expenses. Oh, Mary has no job? Fine. She can watch the kids of Betty, Suzy and Pam while Betty, Suzy and Pam go off to work at their crappy low paying jobs. Everybody contributes. That's the way it goes. I once had 5 people living in my one bedroom apartment to make ends meet.

Guess what? Even back then, I still paid a little bit of Federal Income Tax. Why can't Americans today do that?

If Mary doesn't like the situation, she can find a job, make some money, and move out. If Betty, Suzy and Pam hate their jobs, they too can be looking for another, better job, while they work their crappy jobs to pay the bills. This is what personal responsibility looks like.

And this also begs the question, pre-2008, before the recession, why didn't Mary, Betty, Suzy and Pam save some money for a rainy day? Why didn't they live BELOW their means, knowing that bad times may come one day? Why is their lack of planning MY fault?




Making everyone contribute to government by paying SOME income tax is not mutually exclusive with smaller government. In fact, smaller government benefits pretty much everyone NOT on the government teat by bringing us closer to a balanced budget, creating less future debt for Americans.

Being a long time manager of People, I know there as many reasons why people are in situations as there are people. I personally know individuals who are in difficult situations and their money management had zero to do with it. Sh!t happens and it's because we're the USA, that we're not looking like a third world country.

[Bucwheat]

Niel Boortz and John Linder wrote the Fair Tax book,read it and you will be a big fan.

[Peter Pan]

I am one of the 53% of Federal Income Tax Payers that pays his fair share, if you libs feel more is needed please send in extra for the 47% that wants the freebies you insist they are entitled to. I see only a few libs doing lots extra that we know of Bill Gates is one, but Stephen King needs to give all his income to taxes as he thinks tax on the rich is not enough and the feds already show the rich carry the rest of us, they produced the stats to back up my claims and especially the 47% that do not pay a fair share

[ChasC5]

Originally Posted by Peter Pan

I am one of the 53% of Federal Income Tax Payers that pays his fair share, if you libs feel more is needed please send in extra for the 47% that wants the freebies you insist they are entitled to. I see only a few libs doing lots extra that we know of Bill Gates is one, but Stephen King needs to give all his income to taxes as he thinks tax on the rich is not enough and the feds already show the rich carry the rest of us, they produced the stats to back up my claims and especially the 47% that do not pay a fair share

I gave you the number yesterday, turn them in and get your reward or stop bitching

[Peter Pan]

Originally Posted by ChasC5

I gave you the number yesterday, turn them in and get your reward or stop bitching

Great send in all the excess $$ you have the libs need it for the freebies, as I am taxed enough already and you seem to think many are not so you must be one of them

[RetiredSFC 97]

Let's start with taxing those who pay nothing first, then see where that goes.

[Bill]

Originally Posted by RetiredSFC 97

Let's start with taxing those who pay nothing first, then see where that goes.

The question of taxation and public debt almost exactly mirrors the question of our country's energy policy.

The correct answer is: all of the above.

With regard to energy, we need to drill, baby, drill, burn more coal, increase our energy efficiency, build windmills, install more solar panels, all of it. We need to do everything we can to produce more and use less, for national security reasons.

With regard to the National Debt, we need to get the 47% to start paying, we need to start slashing spending on everything, and this also needs to be done for national security reasons.

The reasons the Soviets exited the world stage was because they were broke, not because they didn't have a kick ass military. That can and will be us if we don't do everything in our power to erase the National Debt.

[Z06PDQ]

Originally Posted by RetiredSFC 97

Let's start with taxing those who pay nothing first, then see where that goes.

it'll go about as far as you can throw them. they have nothing. unless, of course you mean companies like EXXON.

[wicked_c6]

If Mary doesn't like the situation, she can find a job, make some money, and move out. If Betty, Suzy and Pam hate their jobs, they too can be looking for another, better job, while they work their crappy jobs to pay the bills. This is what personal responsibility looks like.

And this also begs the question, pre-2008, before the recession, why didn't Mary, Betty, Suzy and Pam save some money for a rainy day? Why didn't they live BELOW their means, knowing that bad times may come one day? Why is their lack of planning MY fault?

Its called personal responsibility...something that is a dying breed. No one wants to earn, work, and climb their way up the ladders. I see it everyday in hiring people for my dept. Fresh out of college, zero work experience, basic education - but expect to be hired on at 50k a year and balk when they get an offer of 35k. It takes hardwork and effort to get ahead in life. And even then life ain't fair...and its never going to be. Some people have more...some less - but 99.9% of the time (not always) the person with the more sacrificed early in life (either in completing advanced education, not buying new things, etc) so they could build themselves up.

As for "fair taxes". Lets suppose we have 2 families. One makes a million a year...the other 50k. The 50k family (most likely) with all their deductions received back money every year or pay 2k tops. The person who makes a million is in a 35-38% tax bracket...but lets say they have a good accountant and they reduce the tax load to 20%. Thats still 200k in paid taxes. One paid nothing...one pays 200k? Is it the fault of the millionaire that the 50k person isn't a millionaire? Not in my book.

As an example of most small business owners I'll use my FIL. He started his company in 1983 with little more than 5k in funds and 1 assistant. In 28 years he's gone from 1 million in sales to 120 million. However, during that 28 years there were ups and downs. There were years he didn't make a dime of personal income. He drove 8 year old used cars. Didn't go out to dinner. Didn't take vacations. Downsized to a modest house and so on.

Now that he's in the 100 million sales bracket life is very good financially. I don't begrudge him for his fortunes. He worked at his life and took himself from nothing to quite a bit.

Most people who are living paycheck to paycheck seemingly cause it themselves. I know this because I used to live that way. In my earlier years I made 50k a year... But had a huge apartment, all the latest toys, full cable, cell phone, gym membership, brand new car every few years. It was unsustainable...and I knew that. So...what did I do? I woke up and realized I can't get ahead short term and not look at the long term.

I downsized my apt to a 1 bdr, traded in my BMW for a used Cherokee with 100k miles, dropped cable, lowered my cell plan, and cut every expense I could. I used that extra money to start saving. I went back to school (while working 60 hours a week) and finished my masters and several certifications that made me more marketable (and thus provided a higher income). It was a sacrifice. I could have kept on living beyond the means I had...like most families do. I made a choice though...I sacrificed my short term wants for my long term needs.

Again...personal responsibilities...

Whenever I hear a Dem (or non Dem) bitch about people who make alot of money I instantly see them as jealous. Jealous that someone makes that much and they don't. Someone who has the finer things and they don't. But yet when you try and make them see "why" they got ahead, it falls on deaf ears. Why? The jealous person just wanted it all for nothing. He has it...so should I. Reminds me of this updated classic... cheesy I know...but pretty much sums things up. I didn't prepare myself for life, thus you must prepare for me.

The ant works hard in the withering heat and the rain all summer long, building his house and laying up supplies for the winter.

The grasshopper thinks the ant is a fool and laughs and dances and plays the summer away.

Come winter, the shivering grasshopper calls a press conference and demands to know why the ant should be allowed to be warm and well fed while he is cold and starving.

CBS, NBC , PBS, CNN, and ABC show up to provide pictures of the shivering grasshopper next to a video of the ant in his comfortable home with a table filled with food.

America is stunned by the sharp contrast.

How can this be, that in a country of such wealth, this poor grasshopper is allowed to suffer so?

Kermit the Frog appears on Oprah with the grasshopper and everybody cries when they sing, 'It's Not Easy Being Green.'

ACORN stages a demonstration in front of the ant's house where the news stations film the group singing, “We shall overcome.” Then Rev. Jeremiah Wright has the group kneel down to pray to God for the grasshopper's sake.

President Obama condemns the ant and blames President Bush, President Reagan, Christopher Columbus, and the Pope for the grasshopper's plight.

Nancy Pelosi & Harry Reid exclaim in an interview with Larry King that the ant has gotten rich off the back of the grasshopper, and both call for an immediate tax hike on the ant to make him pay his fair share.

Finally, the EEOC drafts the Economic Equity & Anti-Grasshopper Act retroactive to the beginning of the summer.

The ant is fined for failing to hire a proportionate number of green bugs and, having nothing left to pay his retroactive taxes, his home is confiscated by the Government Green Czar and given to the grasshopper.

The story ends as we see the grasshopper and his free-loading friends finishing up the last bits of the ant’s food while the government house he is in, which, as you recall, just happens to be the ant's old house, crumbles around them because the grasshopper doesn't maintain it.

The ant has disappeared in the snow, never to be seen again.

The grasshopper is found dead in a drug related incident, and the house, now abandoned, is taken over by a gang of spiders who terrorize the ramshackle, once prosperous and once peaceful, neighborhood.

The entire Nation collapses bringing the rest of the free world with it.

And one final thought for the resident "From each according to their abilities, to each according to their need" crowd.

I know many arab americans here locally in Michigan. I have a very good friend who owns the gas station down the street from my house. He came from Yemen with barely 1k in his pocket, a rusty command of english, and a family of 5. I asked him his story over beers one night. He worked for 15 years doing 3 jobs, went to night school (community ed) to learn english and business skills...then after saving up 100k over those 15 years purchased a station. He now owns 4 and is doing quite well.

My moral of my long winded post? You want something...go out and fecking work hard for it. Otherwise STFU, get back in your cubicle, and continue your hate for people who have more than you.