Muzzie opens fire in Florida gay club...

[Admiral Blue]

Perhaps the FBI was too busy investigating hillary and they overlooked this piece of trash.

[DAB]

any large gathering of people is a potential target for those who wish to do us harm. we cannot 'harden' every possible place that has more than 3 people in it at a given time.

but we can investigate those who preach and teach harm to us. and then convict them of an appropriate crime and either imprison them or deport them.

we can allow law abiding people the means to defend themselves and others wherever they go. we could even support those who cannot afford a proper gun and ammo with some training and supplies.

but putting our heads in the sands won't fix this and will only result in getting our asses shot at again.

[lspencer534]

Originally Posted by DAB

any large gathering of people is a potential target for those who wish to do us harm. we cannot 'harden' every possible place that has more than 3 people in it at a given time.

but we can investigate those who preach and teach harm to us. and then convict them of an appropriate crime and either imprison them or deport them.

we can allow law abiding people the means to defend themselves and others wherever they go. we could even support those who cannot afford a proper gun and ammo with some training and supplies.

but putting our heads in the sands won't fix this and will only result in getting our asses shot at again.

[VITE1]

Originally Posted by DAB

any large gathering of people is a potential target for those who wish to do us harm. we cannot 'harden' every possible place that has more than 3 people in it at a given time.

but we can investigate those who preach and teach harm to us. and then convict them of an appropriate crime and either imprison them or deport them.

we can allow law abiding people the means to defend themselves and others wherever they go. we could even support those who cannot afford a proper gun and ammo with some training and supplies.

but putting our heads in the sands won't fix this and will only result in getting our asses shot at again.

[Rob]

Chief says police will be ?highly visible? at upcoming Nashville Pride Festival | WKRN News 2

[VITE1]

Originally Posted by Drew M

I disagree. I don't think guns should be allowed in a nightclub. People who are blackout drunk should not be carrying weapons.

"But people who are carrying firearms are responsible." No, they're not all responsible people. Not everyone is going to say 'Sorry, not a single drink for me tonight. I'm carrying a weapon.' Add to that, sometimes responsible people do irresponsible things.

Do you have facts to back that up? I lived in NH where carrying in a bar was legal. in those 20 years I've never heard of a person who was legally carrying having an issue in a bar.

Only the ones who were illegally carrying.

Fact is people who are concealed carry holder are less likely to commit any crime from felonies to traffic infractions.

CPRC in Fox News: Police are extremely Law-abiding, but concealed handgun permit holders are even more so - Crime Prevention Research CenterCrime Prevention Research Center


NY Times Proves Concealed Carry License Holders More Law-Abiding Than the Population. Unintentionally. - The Truth About Guns

[Giraffe (He/Him)]

Originally Posted by Cybercowboy

Actually,,,,,,,,

When it come's the 2nd you'll defend it wholesale. Absolutely zero room for interpretation, you wouldn't deviate one inch. But dammit, the 1st is open to interpretation per your agenda.

[RedLS1GTO]

Originally Posted by VITE1

Do you have facts to back that up? I lived in NH where carrying in a bar was legal. in those 20 years I've never heard of a person who was legally carrying having an issue in a bar.

Only the ones who were illegally carrying.

Fact is people who are concealed carry holder are less likely to commit any crime from felonies to traffic infractions.

CPRC in Fox News: Police are extremely Law-abiding, but concealed handgun permit holders are even more so - Crime Prevention Research CenterCrime Prevention Research Center


NY Times Proves Concealed Carry License Holders More Law-Abiding Than the Population. Unintentionally. - The Truth About Guns

It's impossible to argue with idealism.

[VITE1]

Originally Posted by Thomas

When it come's the 2nd you'll defend it wholesale. Absolutely zero room for interpretation, you wouldn't deviate one inch. But dammit, the 1st is open to interpretation per your agenda.

I seem to have forgotten what part of the constitution extends right to people not citizens or Physical residents of the USA. can you point out that part to me?

And Since FDR refuse to allow Jews to immigrate to the USA before and during WWII because it was felt they could be "Terrorists" ( Actually spies but you get the point)

The U.S. Government Turned Away Thousands of Jewish Refugees, Fearing That They Were Nazi Spies | History | Smithsonian

[Cybercowboy]

Originally Posted by Thomas

When it come's the 2nd you'll defend it wholesale. Absolutely zero room for interpretation, you wouldn't deviate one inch. But dammit, the 1st is open to interpretation per your agenda.

What the actual fvck? That's what you got from that? OK, seriously, the attacks on the First Amendment are almost exclusively from the left, just a handy FYI. "Hate Speech" et al. But this isn't about race or even religion. Islam isn't a religion in the traditional sense. It's a political system wrapped in a bow that has a whiff of religion. You have Islamic states and you have Muslims living in other countries where the goal is to make them Islamic states. I mean, all you have to do is actually listen to what their radicals say. And by radicals, I mean the Mullahs, the Clerics, the esteemed leadership of ISIS. Oh, and even better than that, the one thing you can unify the Shias and the Sunnis over is "convert or die."

[Cybercowboy]

[boracayjohnny]

Originally Posted by Drew M

Sorry, buddy but being an American means I don't have to "keep my pie hole shut."

He's not your buddy, pal.

Originally Posted by Drew M

I can type but I don't keep up on which words are auto censored and which aren't. Get over yourself.

You just have to be the life of the party anywhere you go. You seem to always be looking to argue with some one about some thing.

I'll await an enlightening response.

[Giraffe (He/Him)]

That's what you got from that?

No necessarily but here's what it seems like-

It seems like you're looking for some precedent giving you the ability to launch Muslims from the United States circumventing the 1st Amendment.

But.

You'll defend the 2nd Amendment without so much as entertaining a discussion.

That's what it looks like which may not be your intent.

[Giraffe (He/Him)]

Originally Posted by Drew M

Drunk people do dumb shit. Its common knowledge.

Yeah, pretty much most of my 20's and early 30's.

[Cybercowboy]

Originally Posted by Thomas

No necessarily but here's what it seems like-

It seems like you're looking for some precedent giving you the ability to launch Muslims from the United States circumventing the 1st Amendment.

But.

You'll defend the 2nd Amendment without so much as entertaining a discussion.

That's what it looks like which may not be your intent.

No, that's not it at all. Nobody is talking about banning Islam or Muslims in general. What we are discussing is bringing in tens of thousands of unvetted, completely unknown new immigrants from areas that are essentially war zones. Full of jihadis willing and able to pull off mass killings of Americans. That's it. That's what this is about. It won't keep American citizens from coming and going for the most part, although I'd really like to see some countries such as Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, Iran, Pakistan, Libya, and Syria no-go zones for casual travel. The Orlando shooter traveled to Saudi Arabia several times in the last few years. They are the number one financier of terrorism around the globe, or damn close to it with Iran holding the other spot.

I don't think most people realize they are at war with us. They are. Hoping for puppies and rainbows isn't going to work. They want to kill us and they want our country destroyed. That's their stated goals. One they are actively pursuing, and they use our very freedom against us whenever possible. Having thousands more show up here doesn't "make us a better country", it doesn't prove that we are above all this. It makes us patsies. It makes us fools in their eyes. And honestly, at this point Europe is toast. Give them 30 years and it will be the Caliphate there, unless something major happens between now and then. They simply out-breed Europeans about 10-1. And when they have anything close to a majority, well, that's it.

[69camfrk]

Originally Posted by Cybercowboy

No, that's not it at all. Nobody is talking about banning Islam or Muslims in general. What we are discussing is bringing in tens of thousands of unvetted, completely unknown new immigrants from areas that are essentially war zones. Full of jihadis willing and able to pull off mass killings of Americans. That's it. That's what this is about. It won't keep American citizens from coming and going for the most part, although I'd really like to see some countries such as Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, Iran, Pakistan, Libya, and Syria no-go zones for casual travel. The Orlando shooter traveled to Saudi Arabia several times in the last few years. They are the number one financier of terrorism around the globe, or damn close to it with Iran holding the other spot.

I don't think most people realize they are at war with us. They are. Hoping for puppies and rainbows isn't going to work. They want to kill us and they want our country destroyed. That's their stated goals. One they are actively pursuing, and they use our very freedom against us whenever possible. Having thousands more show up here doesn't "make us a better country", it doesn't prove that we are above all this. It makes us patsies. It makes us fools in their eyes. And honestly, at this point Europe is toast. Give them 30 years and it will be the Caliphate there, unless something major happens between now and then. They simply out-breed Europeans about 10-1. And when they have anything close to a majority, well, that's it.

Islam has destroyed every place and thing it has ever touched. There is no such thing as a moderate. A "moderate" would as soon cut your throat as look at you. Islam is nothing more than an ideology which is socio, economic, military, and political in nature, thinly veiled in religion. Fundamentally, it has no place in America. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, I'm not the most religious person in the world, and really could GAF what your beliefs are. But, when your doctrine states to kill the infidel, which is all of us, then I draw the line. We have constitutional law, they want sharia law. They should never have been allowed to live and flourish here, and thanks to political correctness, no one wants to call it for what it is. America has enough problems without them, but importing problems is insane. I realize the shooter was born here, but his family indoctrinated him in to the insanity known as islam. Tip of the iceberg here......

[lspencer534]

Originally Posted by Thomas

No necessarily but here's what it seems like-

It seems like you're looking for some precedent giving you the ability to launch Muslims from the United States circumventing the 1st Amendment.

But.

You'll defend the 2nd Amendment without so much as entertaining a discussion.

That's what it looks like which may not be your intent.

There's a world of difference between the 2nd Amendment and the 1st Amendment. The 1st Amendment:

Amendment I. Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

Amendment II: A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

I see lots of wiggle-room in the First Amendment, if for not other reason because it covers a lot of things: Religion, speech, the press, assembly, and petitioning for redress of grievances. As an elementary example, I agree that freedom of speech does not give a right to yell, "Fire!", in a crowded theater.

The Second Amendment isn't so inclusive: It is restricted to giving the right of people to keep and bear arms.

Besides, you're confusing two different areas of the law. The First Amendment has nothing to do with immigration and its limitations. The Constitution speaks to immigration only once, and that is to give Congress the exclusive right to enact laws concerning immigration. (Which makes Obama's Executive Orders illegal.)

I'm off the clock right now, so I won't respond to your argument. Immigration is a diverse area of the law, and attorneys tend to specialize in particular types of cases. Just know that you aren't qualified to give opinions on this area of the law; that's best left to actual experts.

[DAB]

unless mrs. clinton grows some balls (so to speak), Trump will be president, due in large part to this incident.

there will be more carnage before that happens.

these killers don't need marching orders from HQ, they believe the koran tells them to do these types of acts when they can. they aren't afraid of dying.

[VITE1]

Originally Posted by Drew M

Skewed statistics and biased articles arent going to tell you anything. Drunk people do dumb shit. Its common knowledge.

Then prove that drunken legal CCW are an issue.
We'll wait.


. If common knowledge and sense we would not have many of todays probelms.

Fact is study after study show CCW. Holders are the least likely to commit any crime.

[Giraffe (He/Him)]

Originally Posted by lspencer534

There's a world of ,,,,,,,,

Come back when you've sobered up Otis.