Trickle down waterfall has already started...

[Bill]

Originally Posted by Jeff '79

Have you ever been to Long Island, Manhattan, etc?
It costs $15.00 to cross the George Washington bridge from Manhattan to Long Island alone. Do that 5 days a week, 52 weeks a year and that is $3900.00 alone per year ! . The infrastructure there is mind boggling and drags the rest of the state down. It really is awe inspiring to see the roads, bridges, tunnels, subways, police presence, garbage service, snow removal, yadda, yadda, yadda.
If you were never there, you just won't get it.
Not to mention the fact that a shit-ton of people who commute to Manhattan to work never pay a cent of NY property tax because they live in NJ.
Upstate NY and Rural Jersey are paying high taxes to help subsidize Manhattan and NE , East , and South Jersey.
We always said that Manhattan and Long Island should their own state. My taxes would go down exponentially.

Vacationed in Manhattan, rode the Orient Express to Brooklyn, did the Staten Island Ferry, and spent a few days upstate. Spring Valley? The town where the American Chopper TV show was filmed, etc. What struck me is once you left Manhattan on the Pallisades, damn, it's beautiful, not anything like I expected.

[Thunder22]

What also hurts about the tax bill is the elimination of the individual deduction of $4050, coupled with them not repealing the AMT (all they did was raise the floor a meaningless amount).

10. Fewer people will have to deal with the alternative minimum tax.

The alternative minimum tax, a parallel tax system that ensures people who receive a lot of tax breaks still pay some federal income taxes, remains in place for individuals. But fewer people will have to worry about calculating their tax liability under the AMT moving forward. The exemption has been raised to $70,300 for singles, and to $109,400 for married couples.

[Thunder22]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

Vacationed in Manhattan, rode the Orient Express to Brooklyn, did the Staten Island Ferry, and spent a few days upstate. Spring Valley? The town where the American Chopper TV show was filmed, etc. What struck me is once you left Manhattan on the Pallisades, damn, it's beautiful, not anything like I expected.

Most people don't know that Suffolk County on Long Island eastward, which comprises most of the Island including the fabled Hamptons, was mostly potato farms until people realized, hey, wait, this is an island, there's beach front property to live on!!!!

that being said, from the Nassau/Suffolk border, inland, not on the north or south shores, a big chunk of the island is still farms, wineries, and pine barrens.

The same can be said of NJ. NJ gets a bad rap because when people visit here, and travel the NJ Turnpike, all they see are huge factories, refineries, and other not beautiful to look at scenery. And that's because those types of industries were purposely built around the transportation/roads that they needed to make their businesses run. If you go 5-10 miles West of the Turnpike, that's where you see how gorgeous NJ really is.

Hell, even the Palisades Parkway that runs north/south from the GW Bridge has some great scenery for almost the entire length of the road.

[FasterTraffic]

I'm glad we have this thread as I considered asking CA folks, e.g., Need-A-Vette their opinion on the tax changes.

Personally, I have two perspectives on this change:

(1) It's the right thing to do. The federal government shouldn't subsidize the liberal kleptocracy in Sacramento. Like many other things related to government and taxes, it's an exception that condones bad behavior.

(2) My family is falling on the grenade for this. It wouldn't be so bad if I had any hope, any at all, that CA would take steps quickly to lighten the burden. As Jerry Brown and his cohorts have shown time and time again, there is no such thing as a bad tax because of all the wonderful things they can do with all our money. They have a tax for something, use that money for something else, and then enact a new tax to pay for s**t the first tax should have covered (e.g., SB1). The loss of SALT is going to hurt for a very, very long time. I doubt there will be any pitchforks and torches because a large portion of the CA population are net consumers who pay little or no tax themselves and want everything subsidized, and another large portion have so much money that they'll skip one or two chartered jet trips a year and forget about the new taxes. I find it extremely unlikely that there is a big enough constituency to force Sacramento to roll back spending.

Long-term, the lowering of mortgage interest deduction is likely to have a less obvious negative effect.

Some salt in the wound...

Originally Posted by cnn

Married couples get less of a benefit with the new SALT deduction since the limit is the same for both single and married filers.

"This is pretty clearly a marriage penalty," said Faulhaber from Georgetown. "If you have two unmarried taxpayers both paying $10,000 in SALT, they will get an aggregate $20,000 when they file, whereas if they get married they suddenly lose $10,000 in deductions."

[bsmith]

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

Texas has no income tax, but has, to me, high real estate tax. $ 4,500 a year on a 2,8xx sq. foot nothing special house seems friggen outrageous to me.

Try $4000 taxes on a 1600fsf house, AND 6% state income tax, AND 7.5% sales tax.
Welcome to Nebraska, the Tax Me state.

[Bill]

Originally Posted by FasterTraffic

I'm glad we have this thread as I considered asking CA folks, e.g., Need-A-Vette their opinion on the tax changes.

Personally, I have two perspectives on this change:

(1) It's the right thing to do. The federal government shouldn't subsidize the liberal kleptocracy in Sacramento. Like many other things related to government and taxes, it's an exception that condones bad behavior.

(2) My family is falling on the grenade for this. It wouldn't be so bad if I had any hope, any at all, that CA would take steps quickly to lighten the burden. As Jerry Brown and his cohorts have shown time and time again, there is no such thing as a bad tax because of all the wonderful things they can do with all our money. They have a tax for something, use that money for something else, and then enact a new tax to pay for s**t the first tax should have covered (e.g., SB1). The loss of SALT is going to hurt for a very, very long time. I doubt there will be any pitchforks and torches because a large portion of the CA population are net consumers who pay little or no tax themselves and want everything subsidized, and another large portion have so much money that they'll skip one or two chartered jet trips a year and forget about the new taxes. I find it extremely unlikely that there is a big enough constituency to force Sacramento to roll back spending.

Long-term, the lowering of mortgage interest deduction is likely to have a less obvious negative effect.

Some salt in the wound...

Your best hope is that Trump's wall and deportation machine will start reducing the amount of takers in your state. That will take some time to achieve, but every illegal you get out lessens the burden on taxpayers. Start putting real numbers on the board and that has to help out your schools, hospitals, prisons, etc. I can't believe that even the Kate Steinle murder hasn't changed the hearts and minds of liberal California voters. WTF happened to, "if it could save just one life?" Protecting criminals from deportation doesn't fit with that narrative at all.

[Thunder22]

Originally Posted by bsmith

Try $4000 taxes on a 1600fsf house, AND 6% state income tax, AND 7.5% sales tax.
Welcome to Nebraska, the Tax Me state.

That's a tax break to NY and NJ residents

[bsmith]

Originally Posted by Thunder22

That's a tax break to NY and NJ residents

Oh, I know.
I'm comparing to Texas...and we don't have anything to do around here.

[Thunder22]

Originally Posted by bsmith

Oh, I know.
I'm comparing to Texas...and we don't have anything to do around here.

gotcha...

[SteelCityBlue]

Originally Posted by bsmith

Oh, I know.
I'm comparing to Texas...and we don't have anything to do around here.

Where does all that money go?

[Bill]

Originally Posted by bsmith

Try $4000 taxes on a 1600fsf house, AND 6% state income tax, AND 7.5% sales tax.
Welcome to Nebraska, the Tax Me state.

Rough. Our sales tax is around 8.25% with many exemptions, including food and medicine. Auto sales tax is 6.25%, which is the state's cut of all sales tax. I'm OK with that as I'd prefer a consumption tax to an income tax, although.....





All Taxation is Theft

Sometimes, you've just got to let the libertarian out!

[VITE1]

It would be nice of the people in the states who got screwed by this tax package did 1 of 2 things.

1)Start voting for politicans who will cut spending as well as local taxes

2) Vote with your feet. I did in 1995. Due to that move I was able to afford a higher quality lifestyle, college paid for my two kids and a low 7 figure retirement net egg.

Many friends and family back on LI NY can't afford retirement unless they were public employees. Even then their lifestyle suffers compared to mine.

[bsmith]

Originally Posted by SteelCityBlue

Where does all that money go?

Damn fine question.
Schools are underfunded, locally were going to have another bond issue for a new jail foisted on us soon. The city I live in approved a $250k outdoor restroom at a crappy public park.
The average house here is half that amount.
Roads are terrible, and the state is facing a big budget shortfall in the coming years.

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

Rough. Our sales tax is around 8.25% with many exemptions, including food and medicine. Auto sales tax is 6.25%, which is the state's cut of all sales tax. I'm OK with that as I'd prefer a consumption tax to an income tax, although.....





All Taxation is Theft

Sometimes, you've just got to let the libertarian out!

Card-carrying Libertarian here.

[Thunder22]

Originally Posted by VITE1

It would be nice of the people in the states who got screwed by this tax package did 1 of 2 things.

1)Start voting for politicans who will cut spending as well as local taxes

2) Vote with your feet. I did in 1995. Due to that move I was able to afford a higher quality lifestyle, college paid for my two kids and a low 7 figure retirement net egg.

Many friends and family back on LI NY can't afford retirement unless they were public employees. Even then their lifestyle suffers compared to mine.

1) Why do you assume we didn't/don't? I'm not a democrat/liberal complaining what big bad Trump did, i'm a Republican who voted for Trump who is complaining that despite voting that way, I still got screwed.

2) As I said earlier, this isn't realistic, all it does is move the tax burden to the destination state. Do you think a state like Florida or Texas could handle 2M or even 500,000 new residents without some sort of tax increase?

And, even if it were realistic, the NY salary doesn't move with you.

[Datawiz]

Originally Posted by Thunder22

And, even if it were realistic, the NY salary doesn't move with you.

I make a strong NY salary working for a NY company, from Florida

[DAB]

Originally Posted by datawiz

I make a strong NY salary working for a NY company, from Florida

Different shorts and flip flops for each day of the week!

[Datawiz]

Originally Posted by DAB

Different shorts and flip flops for each day of the week!

While they are different every day, I wear the same exact thing every day. I have 30 of the same black t-shirt, and blue or black shorts. And I go barefoot.

[VITE1]

Originally Posted by Thunder22

1) Why do you assume we didn't/don't? I'm not a democrat/liberal complaining what big bad Trump did, i'm a Republican who voted for Trump who is complaining that despite voting that way, I still got screwed.

2) As I said earlier, this isn't realistic, all it does is move the tax burden to the destination state. Do you think a state like Florida or Texas could handle 2M or even 500,000 new residents without some sort of tax increase?

And, even if it were realistic, the NY salary doesn't move with you.

1) I lived on LI NY for 40 years. My Dad was a money bundler for the Republican party in Suffolk for decades. IIRC Suffolk went for Trump in 2016. They still have the massive Dem strong holds of the Tri State area screwing the rest of NYS. You didn't get screwed by Trump. You have been getting screwed by NYS and now it's without the lube of tax deductions.

2) Yet allowing the tax deduction moves the burden to the states that don't have in like NH and FL. And IF TX or FL got new residents if they don't have jobs let them die. FL is #1 in the USA for interstate migration of HNW individuals. Let them come here with their money, jobs and mostly conservative viewpoints.


And My NY salary did move with me because I moved my whole business. I got to save 200.00 extra a WEEK due to lower costs, lower taxes and cheaper housing. And I lived much better. Went from a 1200 SQFT condo in Central Islip NY to a 3200 SQFT house in Salem NH for the the same monthly costs.

[DAB]

Originally Posted by datawiz

While they are different every day, I wear the same exact thing every day. I have 30 of the same black t-shirt, and blue or black shorts. And I go barefoot.

ah, casual monday/tuesday/wednesday/thursday/friday !!!!

[Wathen1955]

Originally Posted by FasterTraffic

I'm glad we have this thread as I considered asking CA folks, e.g., Need-A-Vette their opinion on the tax changes.

Personally, I have two perspectives on this change:

(1) It's the right thing to do. The federal government shouldn't subsidize the liberal kleptocracy in Sacramento. Like many other things related to government and taxes, it's an exception that condones bad behavior.

(2) My family is falling on the grenade for this. It wouldn't be so bad if I had any hope, any at all, that CA would take steps quickly to lighten the burden. As Jerry Brown and his cohorts have shown time and time again, there is no such thing as a bad tax because of all the wonderful things they can do with all our money. They have a tax for something, use that money for something else, and then enact a new tax to pay for s**t the first tax should have covered (e.g., SB1). The loss of SALT is going to hurt for a very, very long time. I doubt there will be any pitchforks and torches because a large portion of the CA population are net consumers who pay little or no tax themselves and want everything subsidized, and another large portion have so much money that they'll skip one or two chartered jet trips a year and forget about the new taxes. I find it extremely unlikely that there is a big enough constituency to force Sacramento to roll back spending.

Long-term, the lowering of mortgage interest deduction is likely to have a less obvious negative effect.

Some salt in the wound...

I'm in Northern CA, about 20 miles north-west of Sacramento. Moved here 2.5 years ago from Southern CA where I was born in 1955 in San Diego.

My property tax is $8000/yr. This does not include all the other ridiculous taxes like the latest gas tax increase, the state tax of 11%, plus any local taxes. I've already signed a petition to repeal this new tax, and have it on the ballot for next election cycle where it will require the citizens to vote for the increase instead of the money grabbing socialists in Sacramento.

I know exactly what Thunder is talking about. I more than likely will be in the same boat. The ones living in Silicone Valley and San Fransisco will get screwed big time.