80% 20% explained by an expert.

[C3C7NIC]

BTW, PPE expires,

Plain and simple, not cost effective to keep sock piles of PPE for a just in case Pandemic scenario, because it MOST likely will expire and then be thrown away.

If the government has stock piles and is not distributing them, you should be bitching and moaning at them, no vilifying the medial HEROES that are working hard to save your loved ones.

And superb idea to let the sick people stay isolated and let all those not sick run around, business as usual.

How exactly do you make that determination?

Keep everyone isolated until they get an antibody test?

[Cybercowboy]

Originally Posted by C3C7NIC

And superb idea to let the sick people stay isolated and let all those not sick run around, business as usual.

How exactly do you make that determination?

Keep everyone isolated until they get an antibody test?

Look at what Sweden is doing. Look at their numbers. And people are already "running around" everywhere. With our economy essentially running on "groceries and gas". We could do the same thing and, idk, let people re-open their business if it makes sense for them, their decision and my decision to go there. If you feel sick, stay home. If you are out and about coughing and sneezing on stuff, free pass to knock the shit out of you and bag/tag. From a safe social distance that is, like about 7 feet.

It may be hard for people to comprehend but treating the entire country like NYC is incredibly stupid. It's beyond stupid, it's criminal.

My city wasn't stupid enough to have the mayor and others encouraging us to get out and have a big downtown celebration in late February/early March like DeBlasio, Pelosi, and the mayor of New Orleans did. And now *SHOCKER* they gots the 'rona. The people live stacked on top of each other, sharing the same air through filters that have probably been cleaned twice this millennium. They ride around in tubes that are renown for their spotless cleanliness. They take cab thrice-daily rides in what are considered the cleanest possible vehicles, spotless they are.

Meanwhile Chuck in Lonesome Dove Texas (population **** all) is getting pulled over because he's driving on a highway that has three cars per 10 miles, asking for his travel papers.

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by C3C7NIC

BTW, PPE expires,

Plain and simple, not cost effective to keep sock piles of PPE for a just in case Pandemic scenario, because it MOST likely will expire and then be thrown away.

If the government has stock piles and is not distributing them, you should be bitching and moaning at them, no vilifying the medial HEROES that are working hard to save your loved ones.

And superb idea to let the sick people stay isolated and let all those not sick run around, business as usual.

How exactly do you make that determination?

Keep everyone isolated until they get an antibody test?

Does it expire if vacuum sealed? Nitrogen packed? Has anyone experimented? What is the degradation slope? If it lasts 6 months at 100% integrity and 24 months at 95% integrity, big deal?

[Rodnok1]

Originally Posted by C3C7NIC

BTW, PPE expires,

Plain and simple, not cost effective to keep sock piles of PPE for a just in case Pandemic scenario, because it MOST likely will expire and then be thrown away.

If the government has stock piles and is not distributing them, you should be bitching and moaning at them, no vilifying the medial HEROES that are working hard to save your loved ones.

And superb idea to let the sick people stay isolated and let all those not sick run around, business as usual.

How exactly do you make that determination?

Keep everyone isolated until they get an antibody test?

Any bets if you're allowed back to school in fall without a neg test or a vacinne, I can see schools being closed for another year over this. Sue happy country that we are.

Masks will be required soon in stores that's for sure.

Probably no studies done on PPE expiring time frames, could be(don't nail me to a wall just a comment) that it's a date to keep places buying. I'm sure they do degrade and varies upon manufacturer and items.
We keep stockpiles of things and they go bad all the time, why shouldn't PPE be kept as well? Money as it always comes down to, priorities will change now I bet.

The govt does rotate food stockpiles and other materials.

[C3C7NIC]

Originally Posted by Cybercowboy

Look at what Sweden is doing. Look at their numbers. And people are already "running around" everywhere. With our economy essentially running on "groceries and gas". We could do the same thing and, idk, let people re-open their business if it makes sense for them, their decision and my decision to go there. If you feel sick, stay home. If you are out and about coughing and sneezing on stuff, free pass to knock the shit out of you and bag/tag. From a safe social distance that is, like about 7 feet.

It may be hard for people to comprehend but treating the entire country like NYC is incredibly stupid. It's beyond stupid, it's criminal.

My city wasn't stupid enough to have the mayor and others encouraging us to get out and have a big downtown celebration in late February/early March like DeBlasio, Pelosi, and the mayor of New Orleans did. And now *SHOCKER* they gots the 'rona. The people live stacked on top of each other, sharing the same air through filters that have probably been cleaned twice this millennium. They ride around in tubes that are renown for their spotless cleanliness. They take cab thrice-daily rides in what are considered the cleanest possible vehicles, spotless they are.

Meanwhile Chuck in Lonesome Dove Texas (population **** all) is getting pulled over because he's driving on a highway that has three cars per 10 miles, asking for his travel papers.

Mark my words, just take note right now on Sweden, and check back with me in 2 weeks. Will put a $50 donation to Charity of your choice if I am wrong; but I predict numbers will begin to climb and they will quickly change their protocols.

BTW, you never answered my question, how do you make the determination as to who is contagious. Keeping those in with symptoms is not a great approach. What if they are asymptomatic but have COVID, what if they are symptomatic but only have allergic rhinitis?


BTW: I appreciate being able to delve into this unprecedented topic in a way that does not involve name calling or letting butt~hurtness get in the way of a good debate/discussion.

[C3C7NIC]

Originally Posted by Rodnok1

Any bets if you're allowed back to school in fall without a neg test or a vacinne, I can see schools being closed for another year over this. Sue happy country that we are.

Masks will be required soon in stores that's for sure.

Probably no studies done on PPE expiring time frames, could be(don't nail me to a wall just a comment) that it's a date to keep places buying. I'm sure they do degrade and varies upon manufacturer and items.
We keep stockpiles of things and they go bad all the time, why shouldn't PPE be kept as well? Money as it always comes down to, priorities will change now I bet.

The govt does rotate food stockpiles and other materials.

Originally Posted by aerovette

Does it expire if vacuum sealed? Nitrogen packed? Has anyone experimented? What is the degradation slope? If it lasts 6 months at 100% integrity and 24 months at 95% integrity, big deal?

Great question.

I would guess that much like many things manufactured these days, have a built in failure/expiration date for financial gain.

Much like a carburetor made from plastic.

Even my husband, has to supply PPE for his employees, deals with the same problem. They are given a budget for PPE, and so the city pretty much determines how much they can have at any given time.

Any guess as to how much they had ready for this pandenic?

[Little Red L98.]

Originally Posted by Rodnok1

So it seems the media has switched to nurses blathering on tv(and some Dr's) about how bad it is, they didn't sign up for this amount of sickness and work. Well yes you did... If you didn't think it through beforehand that's on you. A plumber knows exactly what he's in for, an electrical lineman knows he's working in high winds with death always a possibility. A cop knows he can be hurt.
While I feel for nurses and doctors being inundated with an illness with no clear treatment plant, I don't expect them to blather about it either. Perhaps people are getting overly used to non stress at any time jobs and when it comes along they can't handle it(or not prepared) for it mentally.
Could be it's my mentality of non panic in an emergency situation, always time for worrying later.
Panic does nothing but harm in time of crisis. Be prepared and take whatever action you can.

It’s like a service member claiming to be a conscientious objector when the balloon goes up. They were coming out of the woodwork during Gulf I, claiming they only signed up for educational benefits or whatever. Moms were calling congressmen n shit left and right. Uh why do you think you’re learning to shoot and set claymores n shit. Duh.

[Strats-N-Vettes]

Originally Posted by C3C7NIC

Mark my words, just take note right now on Sweden, and check back with me in 2 weeks. Will put a $50 donation to Charity of your choice if I am wrong; but

I predict numbers will begin to climb

and they will quickly change their protocols.

Originally Posted by Strats-N-Vettes

More tests are now available than two weeks ago.
This equates into more people will test positive than two weeks ago.

The numbers will climb because we now know more people are positive than originally thought,
but,
not just because people are spreading it.

[C3C7NIC]

Originally Posted by Strats-N-Vettes

The numbers will climb because we now know more people are positive than originally thought,
but,
not just because people are spreading it.

Yes, BUT... I was speaking more to the fact they will change their current protocol on laxity.

I 100% KNOW that COVID is present in many cities across the world, they just aren't testing so the numbers are not there. The infection rate, as we all know, if much higher than what the reported numbers currently show.

[Strats-N-Vettes]

Originally Posted by C3C7NIC

Yes, BUT... I was speaking more to the fact they will change their current protocol on laxity.

I 100% KNOW that COVID is present in many cities across the world, they just aren't testing so the numbers are not there. The infection rate, as we all know, if much higher than what the reported numbers currently show.

Strange balancing act isn't it?

There are more positives out there, that haven't been tested, that we are finding out now that they are positive because we have more tests available.

add to that fact that:

The current numbers are false because many are including deaths that are barely COVID related/other underlying medical issues, or other illnesses that have similar symptoms.

[C3C7NIC]

Originally Posted by Strats-N-Vettes

Strange balancing act isn't it?

There are more positives out there, that haven't been tested, that we are finding out now that they are positive because we have more tests available.

add to that fact that:

The current numbers are false because many are including deaths that are barely COVID related/other underlying medical issues, or other illnesses that have similar symptoms.

What do you mean "barely" covid related?

I have heard this thrown around, but there is the flaw in that thinking.

Let's say a person has satge 4 cancer and has maybe 6 months to live, but he gets in a car wreck and dies.

COD is not stage 4 cancer, it would be say blunt force trauma/MVA.


So just because someone has other conditions, does not change the fact COVID caused their demise.

[Strats-N-Vettes]

Originally Posted by C3C7NIC

What do you mean "barely" covid related?

I have heard this thrown around, but there is the flaw in that thinking.

Let's say a person has satge 4 cancer and has maybe 6 months to live, but he gets in a car wreck and dies.

COD is not stage 4 cancer, it would be say blunt force trauma/MVA.


So just because someone has other conditions, does not change the fact COVID caused their demise.

A heart patient is in the hospital with congestive heart failure and pneumonia for three weeks, diagnosis is 33% survival...tests positive for COVID and dies.


What is cause of death?
What is being written on death certificate?

[Strats-N-Vettes]

Originally Posted by Strats-N-Vettes

A heart patient is in the hospital with congestive heart failure and pneumonia for three weeks, diagnosis is 33% survival...tests positive for COVID and dies.


What is cause of death?
What is being written on death certificate?

Wanna play with the numbers even more?


An 82y/o heart patient is in the hospital with congestive heart failure and pneumonia for three weeks, diagnosis is 33% survival...tests positive for COVID and dies.



A premie/NICU 3mos old heart patient is in the hospital with congestive heart failure and pneumonia for three weeks, diagnosis is 24% survival...tests positive for COVID and dies.



What is COD?
What is being written on death certificate?

[C3C7NIC]

Originally Posted by Strats-N-Vettes

Wanna play with the numbers even more?


An 82y/o heart patient is in the hospital with congestive heart failure and pneumonia for three weeks, diagnosis is 33% survival...tests positive for COVID and dies.



A premie/NICU 3mos old heart patient is in the hospital with congestive heart failure and pneumonia for three weeks, diagnosis is 24% survival...tests positive for COVID and dies.



What is COD?
What is being written on death certificate?

In any death where COVID confirmed with test and patient died due to that worsening their current condition, yes. COD is COVID.


If a patient that has COVID and they are home recovering and their house catches fire and they die, COD is asphyxiation/smoke inhalation/Fire.



BTW, good morning Cajun, hope you and Pops are staying safe.

[C3C7NIC]

Originally Posted by Strats-N-Vettes

Wanna play with the numbers even more?


An 82y/o heart patient is in the hospital with congestive heart failure and pneumonia for three weeks, diagnosis is 33% survival...tests positive for COVID and dies.



A premie/NICU 3mos old heart patient is in the hospital with congestive heart failure and pneumonia for three weeks, diagnosis is 24% survival...tests positive for COVID and dies.



What is COD?
What is being written on death certificate?

For comparison, if a patient has end stage kidney failure, but over dose on pain meds, COD is not renal failure, but respiratory depression from overdose of opioids. See?

[Mick]

Originally Posted by C3C7NIC

BTW, PPE expires,

Plain and simple, not cost effective to keep sock piles of PPE for a just in case Pandemic scenario, because it MOST likely will expire and then be thrown away.

If the government has stock piles and is not distributing them, you should be bitching and moaning at them, no vilifying the medial HEROES that are working hard to save your loved ones.

I never suggested "stockpiling". I am suggesting inventory management. They are totally different concepts.

[Strats-N-Vettes]

Originally Posted by C3C7NIC

In any death where COVID confirmed with test and patient died due to that worsening their current condition, yes. COD is COVID.
If a patient that has COVID and they are home recovering and their house catches fire and they die, COD is asphyxiation/smoke inhalation/Fire.



BTW, good morning Cajun, hope you and Pops are staying safe.

Hi cutie...yep we are doing good.

and...

COD is not always COVID as being portrayed is what I'm getting at, and it goes back to my firsts posts that the numbers are currently skewed for a few reasons.

[C3C7NIC]

[C3C7NIC]

Originally Posted by Mick

I never suggested "stockpiling". I am suggesting inventory management. They are totally different concepts.

So how does an organization with a specific budget, manage adequate inventory for a pandemic?

I will engage with you in discussion if you remain civil and keep name calling and the like out of it.

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by C3C7NIC

So how does an organization with a specific budget, manage adequate inventory for a pandemic?

I will engage with you in discussion if you remain civil and keep name calling and the like out of it.

If I were the purchasing agent, I'd ask....

What is your Risk Management plan?

What is you capacity if called upon?

What is the lead time to deliver at max capacity?

What are the financial ramifications of the risk and capacity deliveries? (s/b in the risk management plan)


There is nothing new about this. It is due diligence.