So, the Guy Who Got Dragged Off the United Flight....

[Bill]

Originally Posted by Craig

I'm not reading all that...

TL;DR

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by WalkerInTN

I'm sorry to say, the why is irrelevant. If you're told to deplane, you are required by law to do so.

"WHY" is extremely relevant. What if United, for no reason at all, or a bullshit reason, asked you to get off the plane. Wouldn't your first response be to ask why?

Suppose the Delta person says "Sir, we are going to have to ask you to leave the plane because the child in row 5 says you fondled them".

I guess you'd just stroll off and settle it all later? I find that hard to believe.

"Oh, they said I fondled them, oh ok, well, let me get my bag and I'll be on my way".

Not happening.


EDIT: Every time I think I'm out...they pull me back in.

[WalkerInTN]

Originally Posted by aerovette

"WHY" is extremely relevant. What if United, for no reason at all, or a bullshit reason, asked you to get off the plane. Wouldn't your first response be to ask why?

Suppose the Delta person says "Sir, we are going to have to ask you to leave the plane because the child in row 5 says you fondled them".

I guess you'd just stroll off and settle it all later? I find that hard to believe.

"Oh, they said I fondled them, oh ok, well, let me get my bag and I'll be on my way".

Not happening.


EDIT: Every time I think I'm out...they pull me back in.

Yes, my first response would be to ask why. But I know I'll still have to leave the plane, no matter why. It's the law, & they'll enforce it at every airport in the country.

Your Delta argument is stupid. If a child accuses someone of fondling, police are called. Period.

I guess you're trying to make up hypothetical situations because you can't deal with the fact that airport police beat the guy up, not United.

If someone had refused to leave a Delta flight that day at that airport & airport police were called, they would've been the one beaten.

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by WalkerInTN

Yes, my first response would be to ask why. But I know I'll still have to leave the plane, no matter why. It's the law, & they'll enforce it at every airport in the country.

Your Delta argument is stupid. If a child accuses someone of fondling, police are called. Period.

I guess you're trying to make up hypothetical situations because you can't deal with the fact that airport police beat the guy up, not United.

If someone had refused to leave a Delta flight that day at that airport & airport police were called, they would've been the one beaten.

Ok.

It has become unimportant to me. The surest sign of someone having done something wrong is their promise not to do it again...like United has done.

"No paying, seated passenger will be removed from a plane". That is the United position going forward. It should have been that way all along.

[Iron Chef]

Originally Posted by aerovette

Ok.

It has become unimportant to me. The surest sign of someone having done something wrong is their promise not to do it again...like United has done.

It's not that simple.
　
It's very naïve thinking that United and its management really believe that they did something wrong based on public statements by the CEO. This is all about public posturing, damage control and PR. They are also positioning themselves to limit the liability in what is sure to be a massive lawsuit, and as I said in another thread, lawsuits are settled all the time where the plaintiff agrees to a settlement and the company admits no wrongdoing. What the CEO says on CNN is completely irrelevant. The only thing that matters is what's in the settlement documents. Period.

And unless this case goes to trial (which I highly doubt), we will never know exactly what the settlement was because there is sure to be a privacy clause.

Also keep this in mind: As the saying goes, anyone can sue anyone for anything. It's not a guarantee that they'll get out of the lawsuit what they feel they're entitled to. While this guy may have retained a good lawyer, major corporations such as United have battalion-sized legal departments, and I can assure you that these people aren't amateurs. Their sole purpose is to protect the company from excessive liability and I don't think they're the slightest bit intimidated by his defense attorney.

[Gozar]

I am willing to bet I fly more than anyone on this forum. 250k + miles a year on United alone. Add another 20k +/- on the other carriers.

I have NEVER in 22 years seen a passenger mis-treated. I have witnessed on many occasions rude gate agents, rude flight attendants, even rude pilots.

What I have seen more than anything else by a factor of 10 is rude passengers. Entitled little shits. Being demanding, disrespectful, and flat out disgustingly rude. I have watched many people be removed from a plane. All were warned multiple times and every one of them deserved it.

Did United handle this situation correctly? Of course not. Unfortunately large company's work with processes and procedures and the employees cannot act outside of these. People have asked why didn't they put the other flight crew in an Uber or...blah blah blah. The fact is they employees don't have that option. Should they? Probably so. They need additional processes for the unusual or extreme situation.

There are so many people wanting United to fail as a company. That's so dumb. It would hurt thousands upon thousands of families. Pensions lost, lives destroyed over a problem that can be fixed.

[DAB]

and today they have a settlement.

just the way i predicted

United passenger dragged off flight settles with airline for undisclosed amount | Fox News

https://www.thevettebarn.com/forums/...ml#post1553151

[99 pewtercoupe]

and in other news...Delta removed a passenger for using the lavatory

https://gma.yahoo.com/delta-passenge...pstories.html#


Video has emerged of a Wisconsin man who said he was forced off a Milwaukee-bound Delta Air Lines flight after he used a bathroom while the plane was delayed on the tarmac.

Video posted to YouTube shows the man, later identified as Kima Hamilton of Milwaukee, as he argues with a Delta crew member who asked him to exit the plane on April 18.

Fellow passenger Krista Rosolino, who recorded the video, described the incident in an open letter published to a blog.

She said Hamilton got out of his seat to quickly use the bathroom as the plane sat on the runway.

She said he was told that he couldn't use the bathroom the first time he asked to go. After waiting 30 minutes, Hamilton said it was an emergency and went to the restroom, according to Rosolino.

When he returned to his seat, however, a Delta employee told him to exit the plane.

"I need more information, sir," Hamilton is heard saying in the video. "I haven't done anything. I paid for this ticket, and ... I have to be home."

"I tried to hold it the first time, and you said I absolutely couldn't, and I'm being kicked off the plane?" he says. The employee responds, "I need to talk to you outside."

Hamilton said later that the plane was delayed in taking off and he could no longer wait to use the bathroom.

"Sometime later, we were still taxied, [and] the plane hadn't moved ... and it's at an emergency stage now," Hamilton told ABC affiliate WISN on Wednesday.

Describing Hamilton as a "nice gentleman" who played hide-and-seek with her infant as they waited to take off, Rosolino called the incident "the most outrageous treatment of a paying customer that I have seen."

She said the flight crew made all the other passengers get off the plane and reboard after the incident.

"Not only did your staff truly harm and humiliate one person who was forced to pay hundreds of dollars for a new same-day flight, but you forced the rest of us passengers to endure a 2 hour saga of watching a man being targeted for having a bathroom emergency," she wrote.

Hamilton said he eventually complied and exited the plane. He told WISN that he was greeted by FBI agents, who he said arrived to arrest him but decided not to.

He said that he was forced to buy a ticket on another airline at three times the price to get back to Milwaukee.

Hamilton, who is black, told ABC News he was concerned his race may have been a factor, adding that he has not retained an attorney but is keeping his legal options open.

Over email, a Delta spokesperson said that Hamilton was removed from the plane because he did not comply with instructions.

In an accompanying statement sent by the spokesperson, Delta said it was important for passengers to comply with crew members' instructions.

"Our flight crews are extensively trained to ensure the safety and security of all customers," the statement read. "It is imperative that passengers comply with crew instructions during all phases of flight, especially at the critical points of takeoff and landing."


So I guess the Delta folks thought it would have been better for everyone if he just whipped it out and let fly into the seatback in front of him?

[DAB]

when you were a kid, how many times did dad and mom say "go to the bathroom before we get in the car?"

[99 pewtercoupe]

Originally Posted by DAB

when you were a kid, how many times did dad and mom say "go to the bathroom before we get in the car?"

Oh I agree with that. I always try to go in the airport before I get on the plane because airplane lavs are the worst. I am routinely amazed at how many people seem to have to use the lav on even a one hour flight. Don't know if its nerves, not planning ahead or whatever reason

However to kick this guy off the flight as well as inconvenience every other passenger on board by the resulting two hour delay is ridiculous.

[Jeff '79]

Originally Posted by 99 pewtercoupe

Oh I agree with that. I always try to go in the airport before I get on the plane because airplane lavs are the worst. I am routinely amazed at how many people seem to have to use the lav on even a one hour flight. Don't know if its nerves, not planning ahead or whatever reason

However to kick this guy off the flight as well as inconvenience every other passenger on board by the resulting two hour delay is ridiculous.

[Craig]

I don't get on a plane unless there's absolutely no other option. If I can drive it within three hours of a flight, door to door, I drive.

[thefatguy]

i think united should merge with malaysia air--that way
when they beat the hell outta the passengers, no one
will ever find out....

on a more serious note, the LAW is- you must comply with
whatever the flight crew/captain/airport security/police
tell you. period. right or wrong dont matter. end of discussion.

the only people who try to reason around this are the same
types still throwing temper tantrums about trump being president.

ever heard the phrase "we reserve the right to refuse service
to anyone at anytime for any reason"? i was a doorman for 26 years
in various clubs in honolulu, trust me when i say--when the guy
in charge says "get out-NOW." its time to leave. or they will
make you leave, and be within their rights legally to do so.

and i assure you, getting dumb with security, sheriffs, aco's,
police, etc...will ALWAYS end badly for you- EVEN IF YOU WERE RIGHT.
when "the man" says jump, you say yes sir-how high? even if you
KNOW 100% sure you are in the right, record it or ask for names
and FIX IT LATER.

i have been pulled over at 230am with a 12 gauge shotgun in the
car. i didnt get arrested, i didnt get beaten and i didnt get shot.
why? not because of the color of my skin-because i complied
with everything the officer said to do, when he said to do it.
(plus everything was legal and up-to-date)

yes, i got cuffed. yes, i spent several hours in the backseat
of a patrol car. yes, it was an inconvenience. yes, it was
humiliating. and yet, in the end, i was released without getting
beaten, arrested, or shot, my gun was returned to me, and i
was let go on my merry way.

might be something to consider there.

[Iron Chef]

Originally Posted by thefatguy

might be something to consider there.

You should post more often.

[MrPeabody]

Originally Posted by MrPeabody

I imagine they would take the case because the public opinion would lead to a quick out of court settlement. Us armchair lawyers can argue it here all we want but I think the reality is that United will throw some money at this guy get it behind them.

Yup.

[MrPeabody]

Originally Posted by 99 pewtercoupe

and in other news...Delta removed a passenger for using the lavatory

https://gma.yahoo.com/delta-passenge...pstories.html#


Video has emerged of a Wisconsin man who said he was forced off a Milwaukee-bound Delta Air Lines flight after he used a bathroom while the plane was delayed on the tarmac.

Video posted to YouTube shows the man, later identified as Kima Hamilton of Milwaukee, as he argues with a Delta crew member who asked him to exit the plane on April 18.

Fellow passenger Krista Rosolino, who recorded the video, described the incident in an open letter published to a blog.

She said Hamilton got out of his seat to quickly use the bathroom as the plane sat on the runway.

She said he was told that he couldn't use the bathroom the first time he asked to go. After waiting 30 minutes, Hamilton said it was an emergency and went to the restroom, according to Rosolino.

When he returned to his seat, however, a Delta employee told him to exit the plane.

"I need more information, sir," Hamilton is heard saying in the video. "I haven't done anything. I paid for this ticket, and ... I have to be home."

"I tried to hold it the first time, and you said I absolutely couldn't, and I'm being kicked off the plane?" he says. The employee responds, "I need to talk to you outside."

Hamilton said later that the plane was delayed in taking off and he could no longer wait to use the bathroom.

"Sometime later, we were still taxied, [and] the plane hadn't moved ... and it's at an emergency stage now," Hamilton told ABC affiliate WISN on Wednesday.

Describing Hamilton as a "nice gentleman" who played hide-and-seek with her infant as they waited to take off, Rosolino called the incident "the most outrageous treatment of a paying customer that I have seen."

She said the flight crew made all the other passengers get off the plane and reboard after the incident.

"Not only did your staff truly harm and humiliate one person who was forced to pay hundreds of dollars for a new same-day flight, but you forced the rest of us passengers to endure a 2 hour saga of watching a man being targeted for having a bathroom emergency," she wrote.

Hamilton said he eventually complied and exited the plane. He told WISN that he was greeted by FBI agents, who he said arrived to arrest him but decided not to.

He said that he was forced to buy a ticket on another airline at three times the price to get back to Milwaukee.

Hamilton, who is black, told ABC News he was concerned his race may have been a factor, adding that he has not retained an attorney but is keeping his legal options open.

Over email, a Delta spokesperson said that Hamilton was removed from the plane because he did not comply with instructions.

In an accompanying statement sent by the spokesperson, Delta said it was important for passengers to comply with crew members' instructions.

"Our flight crews are extensively trained to ensure the safety and security of all customers," the statement read. "It is imperative that passengers comply with crew instructions during all phases of flight, especially at the critical points of takeoff and landing."


So I guess the Delta folks thought it would have been better for everyone if he just whipped it out and let fly into the seatback in front of him?

I was on a plane once (can't remember the airline) and as we were going down the runway about to lift off some guy stood up and opened the overhead bin to get something. A female Flight Attendant jumped out of her seat and ran down the aisle screaming at him to sit back down. He complied but acted like What the fuck is wrong with her?