Gas Prices Are Low, Stock Market @ All Time High

[Jeff '79]

Originally Posted by Craig

We seemed to have rolled into an insult thread...fine. I'm not sure exactly what you're intentions are, but I'll go back to the original two "facts":

Gas prices might be at an all time low if you account for inflation all the way back to the seventies, not back to the nineties. The stock market is at an all time high for several complicated reasons; stating that Obama has anything to do with it is like me stating that my 401K is an all time high solely because of me.

I guess I'll ad that if Bush somehow lowed gas prices to make himself more popular, then the current President must be something considerably less smart for not doing the same thing, since his popularity is at an all time low.

Gas at an all time low? I never said that.
Stock market at an all time high? FACT
Stating that Obama has anything to do with it ? I never said that
Are you sure that you're reading the same thread?

[American Made]

Originally Posted by Jeff '79

Who do we blame???

As always with everything related to energy I blame the Saudi/U.S. old ass deals. Hello!

[Craig]

Originally Posted by Jeff '79

Gas at an all time low? I never said that.
Stock market at an all time high? FACT
Stating that Obama has anything to do with it ? I never said that
Are you sure that you're reading the same thread?

Okay, I guess you got me there.

[Jeff '79]

Originally Posted by The_Dude

Well, he wasn't running for reelection. The crashing economy doomed McCain. Oil prices dropped because speculators knew that, with the economic crash, the world wasn't going to use nearly as much oil.

Put in proper time perspective, this is the most important line in the thread.
I wonder why the current admin's haters ,didn't jump all over it.
Kudos to The Dude for a dose of reality.

There are things to hate about every administration.
To blame one admin for every problem out there is ludicrous.
It's too bad that the two party system can't morph into a hybrid party, using the best of both parties. That just ain't gonna happen though, because the money that rules them just won't allow it. There won't be tax code reform either, because of the money involved .... Big business and special interests have too much to lose, so allowing a wholesale change won't happen.
These threads turn out badly because people love their country so much, they don't want to see it burn down, and are passionate about their feelings toward fixing it.
Rome is smoldering folks, and it has been for a long time now.
Nothing lasts forever..... Does it?

[Giraffe (He/Him)]

Nothing lasts forever..... Does it?

Except an erection.

[Jeff '79]

Originally Posted by Thomas

Except an erection.

Only on Red when he's in front of his computer...

No wonder why your a lady killer....

[RedLS1GTO]

Originally Posted by Jeff '79

Tax reform is what this country needs. Corporate and personal tax reform.

There are too many loop holes to use, and corporations that make billions pay basically nothing in corporate tax. I don't want to kill 'em, but to pay their fair share would be reasonable. What is a fair share?
A percentage of everything that is sold to a vendor. Period end. Eliminate write offs and all of the complicated tax code. At first corporations would hate it, but the money they'd save in accounting and legal costs would be astounding.

That is 100% pure idealism. Their "fair share"? Some corporations are going to make billions because they have a product that lets them make billions. Good for them. For every 1 that does, there are countless ones that go belly up. Do you really think that if their taxes go up that they are going to just say "Oh well..." and write a check off the top?

Idealism leads one to believe that corporate taxes take all of the extra money that those evil rich meanies are keeping from the starving poor people. The only problem with that theory is that there are exactly zero corporations that pay tax. In reality, every dime comes from the consumer of whatever product they sell.

Hypothetically, if Proctor and Gamble was forced to pay a flat 5% federal tax increase, do you think they would just take it off of their profits and hand it over? Based on your comment above, that's exactly what it sounds like you are claiming. The answer is absolutely not. Congratulations. The price of your Folgers just went up to cover it. It always comes back to the consumer. ALWAYS. For the most part, who are the consumers in this country? The middle class. Do the math on who that corporate tax actually hurts. I promise that the billionaires will still be billionaires but you and I will have less in our pockets every time we buy something.

...and yea, the personal tax code is a joke. You are absolutely right that everybody should pay their "fair share", including not only billionaires, but also the half of the population that as of now contributes absolutely nothing.

[Jeff '79]

Originally Posted by RedLS1GTO

That is 100% pure idealism. Their "fair share"? Some corporations are going to make billions because they have a product that lets them make billions. Good for them. For every 1 that does, there are countless ones that go belly up. Do you really think that if their taxes go up that they are going to just say "Oh well..." and write a check off the top?

Idealism leads one to believe that corporate taxes take all of the extra money that those evil rich meanies are keeping from the starving poor people. The only problem with that theory is that there are exactly zero corporations that pay tax. In reality, every dime comes from the consumer of whatever product they sell.

Hypothetically, if Proctor and Gamble was forced to pay a flat 5% federal tax increase, do you think they would just take it off of their profits and hand it over? Based on your comment above, that's exactly what it sounds like you are claiming. The answer is absolutely not. Congratulations. The price of your Folgers just went up to cover it. It always comes back to the consumer. ALWAYS. For the most part, who are the consumers in this country? The middle class. Do the math on who that corporate tax actually hurts. I promise that the billionaires will still be billionaires but you and I will have less in our pockets every time we buy something.

...and yea, the personal tax code is a joke. You are absolutely right that everybody should pay their "fair share", including not only billionaires, but also the half of the population that as of now contributes absolutely nothing.

So the Vandebilts and the Morgans of the world should have just used the roads and infrastructure for free, and taken over the world hu?
What about the off shore corporations that pay nothing and reap the rewards of our facility?
I understand that their costs are built into our prices, but the abuse is rampant, and needs to be simplified and fixed.

[onedef92]

Milk prices could spike to $8 a gallon, too, I read....


Milk Prices May Soar to $8 a Gallon

Oct 28, 2013 8:34am

Partisan gridlock in Congress may lead to sharply higher milk prices in the new year. It’s the latest sign that the deep divide between Democrats and Republicans is having a direct impact on consumers and the economy.

Milk prices could at least double in January if there is no agreement on farm price supports. The current fight over the $80 billion-a-year food stamp program is a big part of this. The farm bill money includes food stamps as well as farm subsidies.

Without a deal, consumers in January could pay $8 for gallon of milk. Members of the House and Senate are set to begin negotiations this week on the five-year farm bill. Both sides are far apart on the sensitive issue of how much money to cut from food stamps.

[Cybercowboy]

Originally Posted by RedLS1GTO

That is 100% pure idealism. Their "fair share"? Some corporations are going to make billions because they have a product that lets them make billions. Good for them. For every 1 that does, there are countless ones that go belly up. Do you really think that if their taxes go up that they are going to just say "Oh well..." and write a check off the top?

Idealism leads one to believe that corporate taxes take all of the extra money that those evil rich meanies are keeping from the starving poor people. The only problem with that theory is that there are exactly zero corporations that pay tax. In reality, every dime comes from the consumer of whatever product they sell.

Hypothetically, if Proctor and Gamble was forced to pay a flat 5% federal tax increase, do you think they would just take it off of their profits and hand it over? Based on your comment above, that's exactly what it sounds like you are claiming. The answer is absolutely not. Congratulations. The price of your Folgers just went up to cover it. It always comes back to the consumer. ALWAYS. For the most part, who are the consumers in this country? The middle class. Do the math on who that corporate tax actually hurts. I promise that the billionaires will still be billionaires but you and I will have less in our pockets every time we buy something.

...and yea, the personal tax code is a joke. You are absolutely right that everybody should pay their "fair share", including not only billionaires, but also the half of the population that as of now contributes absolutely nothing.

Populists are easily manipulated into accepting socialist policies. Capitalism is not their strong suit. Class warfare is simply part of their DNA. Straw men are their weapons of choice.

[Joecooool]

Originally Posted by Jeff '79

So the Vandebilts and the Morgans of the world should have just used the roads and infrastructure for free, and taken over the world hu?
What about the off shore corporations that pay nothing and reap the rewards of our facility?
I understand that their costs are built into our prices, but the abuse is rampant, and needs to be simplified and fixed.

The Walton family of Walmart own more wealth than the bottom 40 percent of America.

They exploit tax loop holes they lobbied for, pay far less income tax as a percentage of income than their workers, and rely on the government to pay for most of their work force health care costs, food stamps, child care and affordable housing.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...ealth-bottom-/

How Wal-Mart?s Waltons Maintain Their Billionaire Fortune - Bloomberg

PolitiFact | Alan Grayson says more Walmart employees on Medicaid, food stamps than other companies

They abuse the capitalist system, buy off politicians, and then rely on socialism to maximize profits.

[Craig]

Originally Posted by Joecooool

The Walton family of Walmart own more wealth than the bottom 40 percent of America.

They contribute more to society than the bottom 40 percent of America.

[Joecooool]

Originally Posted by Craig

They contribute more to society than the bottom 40 percent of America.

That might be the single dumbest thing ever posted on the internet.

[Giraffe (He/Him)]

They exploit tax loop holes they lobbied for

Well, who wouldn't for crying out loud?

[Jeff '79]

Originally Posted by Craig

They contribute more to China than the bottom 90 percent of America.

*fixt

[Jeff '79]

Originally Posted by Joecooool

The Walton family of Walmart own more wealth than the bottom 40 percent of America.

They exploit tax loop holes they lobbied for, pay far less income tax as a percentage of income than their workers, and rely on the government to pay for most of their work force health care costs, food stamps, child care and affordable housing.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...ealth-bottom-/

How Wal-Mart?s Waltons Maintain Their Billionaire Fortune - Bloomberg

PolitiFact | Alan Grayson says more Walmart employees on Medicaid, food stamps than other companies

They abuse the capitalist system, buy off politicians, and then rely on socialism to maximize profits.

Excellent example.

I work for a Warren Buffett owned company in their accounting department. We do everything by the book, within the legal limit of the law.
If it's legal, than why not??? Just like Thomas said, who wouldn't???
From where I sit, and as a former landlord of a few properties for the last 25 years, the system is so fk's up that the common man can't even do the EZ Tax form at tax time.
A flat rate would fix all that. It does not get any easier than "pay 20% for everything that you sell as a business and 20% of everything that you make as an employee".
The paperwork and man hours involved with accounting for a 900 employee business is mind boggling.

[Cybercowboy]

Remember Craig, I'm the bully.

[Jeff '79]

Originally Posted by Cybercowboy

Remember Craig, I'm the baby.

*fixt

Craig makes valid, rational points.
You make useless name calling posts that don't contribute to the thread...
For every thread that you post in.

[Giraffe (He/Him)]

Originally Posted by Cybercowboy

Remember Craig, I'm the bully.

No, you just come in and shit all over threads whenever it's convenient, or when you think you have enough facts to be a prick. Which I might add is often, and usually you're ill informed.

But that's you. We all have our cross to bear. Your's is just ugly.

[Cybercowboy]

Originally Posted by Jeff '79

*fixt

Craig makes valid, rational points.
You make useless name calling posts that don't contribute to the thread...
For every thread that you post in.

If you read this thread, from the start, you will see who started the name calling.

And Thomas, I'm better informed that 90% of Americans. Of that there is no doubt. At least I didn't vote for a community organizer with zero business experience, twice.

It is amazing to me how some people act at times. Double standards, ridiculous assertions, and very thin skin when they claim otherwise. Start troll threads, call foul when it's pointed out, whine, bitch, point fingers. It just gets old.