A little help (Tractor related)

[MEANZ06]

Some here may remember that I bought a '75 farm tractor a year or so ago to help us clean up our vacation/retirement property and so far its been perfect for our needs.

Something went wrong with the starter or whatever and I can't figure it out. first I tried to get the starter off, that's a big fat "No" it sits right where the arm for the bucket is, I could get to 2 bolts but the third on the backside against the block is impossible the way it's sitting right now. when I try to start it the starter spins but nothing.

I thought maybe a dead spot on the flywheel and drug it with my truck (not easy with the bucket and bush hog out back down) but I managed to move it a foot or more. Nope, same thing. At this point it could be the seloniod (another on the backside, against the block, impossible to reach item) or whatever, I don't want to pay some to come fix it I want to get it running myself...

Any suggestions?

Maybe WOEII will see this and give an opinion.

[Mr.Bigg]

Put it on a charger to make sure it is good and hot battery then smack the starter a few good wraps. The bendix is sticking. If there is any way to spray some lube on it would be great. Also if you can clean the contacts or jump the solinoid might do the trick as well.

[69camfrk]

I agree with the above post. A "dead" spot on the flywheel would result in the starter gear spinning free because a tooth is missing. Thus, your starter would be running. Check your battery, then work your way forward with wiring, etc. until you get to the solenoid or starter. If the solenoid took a shit, you should still get a "click", but no starter activation.

[Rodnok1]

Sure sounds like selenoid issue. If can get something on it to smack it with to maybe free it up. Unfortunately I'd say that starter needs to come off.

[Bill]

Originally Posted by MEANZ06

Some here may remember that I bought a '75 farm tractor a year or so ago to help us clean up our vacation/retirement property and so far its been perfect for our needs.

Something went wrong with the starter or whatever and I can't figure it out. first I tried to get the starter off, that's a big fat "No" it sits right where the arm for the bucket is, I could get to 2 bolts but the third on the backside against the block is impossible the way it's sitting right now. when I try to start it the starter spins but nothing.

I thought maybe a dead spot on the flywheel and drug it with my truck (not easy with the bucket and bush hog out back down) but I managed to move it a foot or more. Nope, same thing. At this point it could be the seloniod (another on the backside, against the block, impossible to reach item) or whatever, I don't want to pay some to come fix it I want to get it running myself...

Any suggestions?

Maybe WOEII will see this and give an opinion.

~disconnect bucket and arms from tractor

~ use truck to pull tractor away from bucket, then use truck to pull start the tractor to drive it to the place you want to change out the starter

~ alternately (pun intended), hook up the truck's battery to the tractor battery, and try to start it while your buddy beats on the starter with a wood block or wrench, then use tractor power to lift bucket arms out of the way

[Mr.Bigg]

If you do end up needing to pull it you can jack or hoist the arms out of the way just need to Crack loose the hydro lines to relieve the pressure and block them well.

[Mick]

Originally Posted by 69camfrk

I agree with the above post. A "dead" spot on the flywheel would result in the starter gear spinning free because a tooth is missing. Thus, your starter would be running. Check your battery, then work your way forward with wiring, etc. until you get to the solenoid or starter. If the solenoid took a shit, you should still get a "click", but no starter activation.

I'm not sure I agree with this post. If the solenoid took a shit, but the starter motor was still working, I think you would NOT hear the click of the solenoid, but would hear the spinning of the starter.

[69camfrk]

Originally Posted by Mick

I'm not sure I agree with this post. If the solenoid took a shit, but the starter motor was still working, I think you would NOT hear the click of the solenoid, but would hear the spinning of the starter.

From my experience, the solenoid has always made a clicking sound, but would not engage the starter. The old hammer tap is sometimes a quick fix, but the solenoid obviously needed to be replaced.

[MEANZ06]

Originally Posted by Mr.Bigg

Put it on a charger to make sure it is good and hot battery then smack the starter a few good wraps. The bendix is sticking. If there is any way to spray some lube on it would be great. Also if you can clean the contacts or jump the solinoid might do the trick as well.

The day it didn't work I used it to jump start my truck, it started just fine but after that the problem started

Originally Posted by 69camfrk

I agree with the above post. A "dead" spot on the flywheel would result in the starter gear spinning free because a tooth is missing. Thus, your starter would be running. Check your battery, then work your way forward with wiring, etc. until you get to the solenoid or starter. If the solenoid took a shit, you should still get a "click", but no starter activation.

I'm skeptical on the flywheel (but it still could be the flywheel) I drug it in gear to turn it and the same, no go.

Originally Posted by Rodnok1

Sure sounds like selenoid issue. If can get something on it to smack it with to maybe free it up. Unfortunately I'd say that starter needs to come off.

I've smacked the started while wife cranking it, and no go I think I have to get it off, meaning getting to That 3rd bolt

Originally Posted by bill_daniels

~disconnect bucket and arms from tractor

~ use truck to pull tractor away from bucket, then use truck to pull start the tractor to drive it to the place you want to change out the starter

~ alternately (pun intended), hook up the truck's battery to the tractor battery, and try to start it while your buddy beats on the starter with a wood block or wrench, then use tractor power to lift bucket arms out of the way

I've done the second part of your suggestion. I haven't even thought of taking the bucket off, there's got to be an easier way

Originally Posted by Mick

I'm not sure I agree with this post. If the solenoid took a shit, but the starter motor was still working, I think you would NOT hear the click of the solenoid, but would hear the spinning of the starter.

the starter clicks and spins as normal I'm just not sure the solenoid is kicking the gear out.

Originally Posted by 69camfrk

From my experience, the solenoid has always made a clicking sound, but would not engage the starter. The old hammer tap is sometimes a quick fix, but the solenoid obviously needed to be replaced.

This is what I'm thinking. I've heard/seen/fixed this issue many years ago, not a big issue until you have that arm covering the sight of the entire starter. I'll get a video a little later or in the morning to better describe what I'm dealing with. Thanks for the suggestions, keep'em coming

[JRD77VET]

If the starter is spinning but the gear is not engaging the on the flywheel, it would seem the gear is not "throwing out" on the shaft.

Any access holes you could spray some KROIL into to free it up?

[Mr.Bigg]

Originally Posted by JRD77VET

If the starter is spinning but the gear is not engaging the on the flywheel, it would seem the gear is not "throwing out" on the shaft.

Any access holes you could spray some KROIL into to free it up?

sticky bendix. Any inspection plate or hole will do. Maybe so warmth if it is cold there. Did you try jumping the solinoid yet?

[JRD77VET]

Can you get a picture of the "hidden" bolt? Maybe some brainstorming will come up with an idea where it would be the last time it would need to be removed.

[Mr.Bigg]

Is your battery fully charged?

[Grey Ghost]

There is a possibility of it also being the ignition switch. Most likely the solenoid though. I took mine off my '74 C10...laying on my back in the driveway and that original heavy son of a gun with the wires barely long enough to reach it. Most of us have been there. But, I took it all apart and cleaned it up. I didn't rebuild it,etc...just gave everything a good cleaning. O'Reilly's it tested just fine. Laying on my back in the driveway again and hoisting the heavy SOB back up while trying to get the bolts started and wiring in position....PITA...tried it...click click click! Zip, nothing. Rinse, repeat. Took it to Autozone and it failed. Anyway...check and clean all your grounds first. Make sure you have proper battery voltage..6v/12v. If you remove it. They should be cheap enough to replace it or get it rebuilt. Sounds like you will need some swivel extensions etc for the hidden bolt.

[99 pewtercoupe]

Call “The Guy”

[MEANZ06]

Originally Posted by JRD77VET

If the starter is spinning but the gear is not engaging the on the flywheel, it would seem the gear is not "throwing out" on the shaft.

Any access holes you could spray some KROIL into to free it up?

Originally Posted by Mr.Bigg

sticky bendix. Any inspection plate or hole will do. Maybe so warmth if it is cold there. Did you try jumping the solinoid yet?

Originally Posted by JRD77VET

Can you get a picture of the "hidden" bolt? Maybe some brainstorming will come up with an idea where it would be the last time it would need to be removed.

Been cleaning up the property by hand and it got dark now. I'll get some pics and maybe a vid in the morning to see the confined space in the morning

Originally Posted by Mr.Bigg

Is your battery fully charged?

Originally Posted by Grey Ghost

There is a possibility of it also being the ignition switch. Most likely the solenoid though. I took mine off my '74 C10...laying on my back in the driveway and that original heavy son of a gun with the wires barely long enough to reach it. Most of us have been there. But, I took it all apart and cleaned it up. I didn't rebuild it,etc...just gave everything a good cleaning. O'Reilly's it tested just fine. Laying on my back in the driveway again and hoisting the heavy SOB back up while trying to get the bolts started and wiring in position....PITA...tried it...click click click! Zip, nothing. Rinse, repeat. Took it to Autozone and it failed. Anyway...check and clean all your grounds first. Make sure you have proper battery voltage..6v/12v. If you remove it. They should be cheap enough to replace it or get it rebuilt. Sounds like you will need some swivel extensions etc for the hidden bolt.

I know how to rebuild them, it's just a very confined space with the arm in the way/covering it. getting it out would be tough in an ideal situation but the arm is a deal breaker as of right now

I'll figure it out eventually

[Bill]

Originally Posted by MEANZ06

Been cleaning up the property by hand and it got dark now. I'll get some pics and maybe a vid in the morning to see the confined space in the morning





I know how to rebuild them, it's just a very confined space with the arm in the way/covering it. getting it out would be tough in an ideal situation but the arm is a deal breaker as of right now

I'll figure it out eventually

Removing the bucket assembly can't be that hard. You've got what, 3 hydraulic hoses to disconnect, and probably a pin on each side to remove. In fact, if your hoses are long enough, you might be able to detach the arms, use wood to prop up the arms, and pull the tractor back enough to get at the starter without even disconnecting the hydraulic hoses. The hardest part of that would be getting something to prop up the lift arms, so that they will be in place to hook them back up.

Also, no matter what you decide, you know we want pictures to assess the situation.

[Aerovette]

Originally Posted by Mick

I'm not sure I agree with this post. If the solenoid took a shit, but the starter motor was still working, I think you would NOT hear the click of the solenoid, but would hear the spinning of the starter.

The solenoid is the switch that turns on the starter. No solenoid, no starter turn.

When the starter gear breaks, you get solenoid and starter turn, but no engine turn.

Been there done that, got the t-shirt... greasy fixing it.

OP. if you get it off, you may want to see if studs and nuts are a better solution for a future repair.

[Olustee bus]

I had a problem once on my vette where the starter would spin but the engine would not turn over. Turned out that the flywheel ring would spin but the flywheel it self would not spin. Wild guess but your flywheel may have a ring for it's teeth and it spins. Most likely you cannot see your flywheel, correct?

[Mick]

Originally Posted by aerovette

The solenoid is the switch that turns on the starter. No solenoid, no starter turn.

If I'm not mistaken, your solenoid is not a switch. It is an electromagnet that when turned on by the ignition switch, pushes the starter motor gear out to engage the flywheel.