Corporations Hoarding the Money

[ChasC5]

Originally Posted by Z06PDQ

"deep thought?" like the fact that we were losing 750,000 jobs/mo. when your boy W left office? "deep thought" like realizing that over 3 million people are indirectly employed by GM as vendors & suppliers? face the facts, dude. the bailout was a huge success for GM & the USA. burns yerass don' it?

Hay, I thought they are for Big Business?

[Z06PDQ]

Originally Posted by TxAg

Capitalism isn't perfect, but it's the best option out there for giving people the potential to succeed. If you're looking for something "perfect", you better find another planet cause it ain't here.

And FYI, the US isn't a 100% capitalistic/free market.

However, what has a proven track record of failure is communism from what I've seen.

USSR - Failed
Eastern Germany - Failed

Here are some fun maps for comparision:
Those Communist states 1979 and 1983

Communist states today

Now let's look at some current communist countries:
China, Cuba, Laos, North Korea, and Vietnam.

If communism (an anti-capitalism idea) is so great, why aren't those countries head and shoulders above the rest of the world? The only one remotely close is China and that's because they are dependent on the rest of the free world for their economy right now.


Begin liberal spin in 3....2....1....go

you don't need to preach to me about how it works. Google "Mixed Economy." you probably already know it, but that's what we have in the good old USA & the inner workings just shifted a little to correct for the absolute **** up that was the last 30 years under "Supply Side, Trickle Down" bull**** economics that has nearly ruined us.

[Y2Kvert4me]

Originally Posted by Z06PDQ

the bailout was a huge success for GM

Why should it be? Seriously....why do WE get to reward them for failing so miserably?

& the USA.

Short term? Perhaps. It's like taking a huge cash advance on your CC and running wild with it. It may feel exhilarating right now, not so much later.

Remember, the people making these decisions are running the country. Not a household, not even a small company, either of which can easily go BK and walk away unaffected when the schit hits the fan.

Using that same carefree mentality on a nation does NOT work, these debts aren't going to magically disappear.

burns yerass don' it?

You bet it does.

Picture perfect example of knee-jerk mismanagement. Either as a business or as a government.

[ChasC5]

It's Tuesday October 19th the year 2010.

The Republicans loss the election, get over it!

[Z06PDQ]

Originally Posted by Y2Kvert4me

Why should it be? Seriously....why do WE get to reward them for failing so miserably?
it's called "damage control." it's called "doing the right thing or going down in flames."

Short term? Perhaps. It's like taking a huge cash advance on your CC and running wild with it. It may feel exhilarating right now, not so much later.

Remember, the people making these decisions are running the country. Not a household, not even a small company, either of which can easily go BK and walk away unaffected when the schit hits the fan.

Using that same carefree mentality on a nation does NOT work, these debts aren't going to magically disappear.

You bet it does.

Picture perfect example of knee-jerk mismanagement. Either as a business or as a government.

We both agree on the "mismanagement" of GM. it wasn't the "evil unions" that made them build sh1tty cars when the public begged for better autos.

[Y2Kvert4me]

Originally Posted by ChasC5

It's Tuesday October 19th the year 2010.

The Republicans loss the election, get over it!

Don't really care which party is in place, just get some people with some basic economic and business sense in place that know how to manage a budget and we'll be moving forward.

The ones currently running the show have a stunning resume of bankrupting the states of IL, CA, and NY.

I have very little trust in them not making the USA insolvent as well.

[Cobra4B]

Originally Posted by ChasC5

Are you paying more or less in Taxes over the last year?

Originally Posted by TxAg

Please explain how trying to directly correlate my specific situation to the facts posted above would go to disprove those facts.

That's how Chas argues.... when he's wrong at the macro level he asks the same question at the micro level.

[WKMCD]

Originally Posted by TxAg

Are you sure?

Where do you think corporations get money to pay taxes? It's really pretty basic business economics.

[ChasC5]

Originally Posted by TxAg

Oh I've been in PRC on CF enough to know the MO of Chas, Exotix and the rest.

That's why I've resolved myself not to even try and debate most of those on the "left".

You’ve resolved yourself to not debate … that’s exactly what happens on the CF PR&C and Digital Corvettes, and that’s what makes them irrelevant what it comes to talking politics. They are not the place where free opinions are welcomed; it’s the place where cowards go to make themselves feel better about their own inadequateness. That’s typically what is happening in politics today; when someone has a different view than them, they pack up their toys and kick everyone they don’t like out of their little sand-box and pout like little babies.

There’s one undeniable fact and people need to begin to get a grip on reality; this country will never go backwards … so deal with it.

Ignorance is not bliss, it’s just ignorance, so stop running from the debate and start engaging in the debate.

[DropTheTop]

ChasC5 - You sound like a real nut, posting blather like that. We already have gone backwards - all the way to the 1930's, thanks to current administration. I don't usually argue politics either, as it is too strong a subject. Never once will you agree or change your stance, no matter how strong the argument. What's more unbelievable to me is that you consider all of the people you bantered with on other sites to be cowards with inadequacies. Are you going to think that of this place, if met with the opposition you faced elsewhere? Why would anyone wish to engage you with that sort of attitude?

[Exotix]

Originally Posted by TxAg

Oh I've been in PRC on CF enough to know the MO of Chas, Exotix and the rest.

That's why I've resolved myself not to even try and debate most of those on the "left".

How come when you do search of the Exotix ... his name appears at the top of the list of todays threads calling for his return although I've been banned for over a year now ?

[ChasC5]

Originally Posted by TxAg

99% of the internet/www forums are irrelevant for "talking politics". There is no intelligent discussion on most of them.




That runs both ways depending on the forum one visits. Don't point the finger just at CF or DC. There's plenty on both sides of the isle that do the same thing.




I would generally agree. From my POV it's been those on the left which seem to do this more. YMMV.




To some extent yes. The politics in this country has become very polarized. Too much finger pointing. Too much selfishness. Too much "I'm right and never admit I'm wrong". Too much bias in getting the facts to the people.
Those things have helped contribute to the current political atmosphere.




Depends on what you define as "reality". Becoming more socialist? I don't agree with that ideal and will fight it. That's reality to me. If you tell me I need to get a grip that the country is going that directly and there's nothing I can do about it then you and I will never live in the same "reality".




I'd be happy to engage in an intelligent conversation where facts are presented and discussed. Name calling of people and baiting tactics dropped. Until then, there is no real "debate" going on. There's just people on either side beating their chests, yelling like Tarzan and doing no good.

That gives me an idea:
https://www.thevettebarn.com/forums/p...ate-facts.html

I understand and respect your opinion, but you have to admit, much of that the GOP and Tea party types are talking about, are remove, repeal, and go back to … not modify, enhance or innovate. I will not call doing what we were doing in the 1920s progress.

[ChasC5]

Originally Posted by DropTheTop

ChasC5 - You sound like a real nut, posting blather like that. We already have gone backwards - all the way to the 1930's, thanks to current administration. I don't usually argue politics either, as it is too strong a subject. Never once will you agree or change your stance, no matter how strong the argument. What's more unbelievable to me is that you consider all of the people you bantered with on other sites to be cowards with inadequacies. Are you going to think that of this place, if met with the opposition you faced elsewhere? Why would anyone wish to engage you with that sort of attitude?

Example of going backwards ...

If the current administration took the United States of America backwards in only 23 months ... then I'm sure you'll show me.

[ChasC5]

Originally Posted by TxAg

I do not consider repealing the awful heath bill as going back to the 1920's.

I believe there could be something much better created.

Could you give me some direct references to what 1920's laws the "GOP and Tea party types" are wanting to have re-enacted?

I'm honestly not aware of any.

Do Amendments come to mind, how about The Constitution?

I can go on and on, but I think YouTube has all the examples.

Got to do some work ... I'll be back later.

[Y2Kvert4me]

Originally Posted by TxAg

Wait you just said corporations don't pay taxes. Now you're saying they do.

Which is it?

Kinda surprised that one sailed right over your head.

What he means is the cost of their corporate tax is part of determining the selling price of product or service offered.

The tax is a percentage as always. So if you earn more by selling more, you are taxed more. Very easy to break that down and figure your "tax per dollar sold", and adjust sell price up accordingly to offset it.

In other words, that tax cost is passed right on to the consumer, who (if retail) then pays the Gov't even more tax for the luxury of purchasing that something.

So essentially, although Corporations most definitely pay tax, as long as they are producing and selling, the smart ones really aren't. They are collecting it from their customers and passing it on to uncle sam.


And if you wish to think another step deeper than that, it's a partial reason why inflation rises almost immediately after taxes are raised.


Our leftist consumers seem to have the desire to pay higher prices for products, and spend more on sales tax too, simply because they support raising taxes to those "crook" corporations.


They just don't get it....

[Z06PDQ]

raising taxes on corporations will force them to invest money in the business to qualify for tax breaks. investing money in the business means more jobs. more jobs means John Q Public has more money to spend on the U S economy. = everybody wins.

[Y2Kvert4me]

Originally Posted by Z06PDQ

raising taxes on corporations will force them to raise their prices, which is the definition of inflation.

Net effect: Everyone pays more to the Gov't, except the Corporation itself.

Fixed.

[WKMCD]

Unfortunately, it doesn't work that way. Tax increases and associated investment deductions are not revenue positive for a business. There is also a price point at which consumers will stop buying particularly in a down economy time. The price increase of good and services being sold due to the tax increase will cause some not to purchase resulting in lower sales and the need for fewer people to produce the commodity or service.

Nobody wins.

[Z06PDQ]

the hell it doesn't "work that way." it does & it has for decades. that's what a "tax shelter" is.if they price themselves out of the market they are fools.

[Y2Kvert4me]

Originally Posted by WKMCD

Unfortunately, it doesn't work that way. Tax increases and associated investment deductions are not revenue positive for a business. There is also a price point at which consumers will stop buying particularly in a down economy time. The price increase of good and services being sold due to the tax increase will cause some not to purchase resulting in lower sales and the need for fewer people to produce the commodity or service.

Nobody wins.

It depends really on the exact business and market in question.

I know this practice is alive and well in business-to-business dealings, especially in very specialized sectors where only a few competitors may exist. It really depends on how captive of a customer base you have.

Much like gas stations, they tend to work in unison, if one raises price, the rest follow suit. The one oddball that always needs to set the price lower than everyone else to garner market share is usually the first to fail. But again, it depends on the exact nature of the business and market served.

And I never said it contributed to positive revenue either. It is or should be a break-even deal for a company. When prices go up, some people stop buying, some shop around, some have no choice not to buy.

But again, it was ultimately the fools in Gov't that decided the price should go up in hopes of cashing in on it via higher taxation. And it fails every time it's tried.