Strength of the C4 Frame and the Van Steel QA1 Coilover
 

Ive been waiting for this one to come to an end but, other issues come up to the surface.

On October 2nd I was on a mountain run with few C5, C6 and Z06 and we had a blast. On
my way home I had my confidence too high and I was heading home like a bat out of hell on NOS.
There it was the double back-to-back curves waiting for me. I took the first one but,
The Ghost could not handle the second one and lost control.

bare with me, this one may be a bit long

This picture was taken facing the direction I was coming.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...QA1Frame/1.jpg

Once I lost control, The Ghost was taking the curve completely sideways, I turned
the wheel towards the slide but, the curve ended and it hit the berm.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/2A.jpg

Took that one down

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...QA1Frame/3.jpg

That where it landed. Yes, landed and I will prove it to you.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...QA1Frame/4.jpg

There was dirt flying all over in 3D, I thought it was over; bent frame, destroyed front
end etc.. The Ghost was stock and on one side, the engine was running. I tried to take
off but, the tires were on the air. I stepped outside and it was covered on dirt but, there
was no damage to anything outside the car. No busted wheels or tires, no smoke and
I saw no gaps on the fiberglass.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...QA1Frame/5.jpg

I decided to do my best, using my hands I removed dirt from the front of the
tires, got back in, started the engine, turned the ASR off, 1st gear and...

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...QA1Frame/6.jpg

...that son of a bitch took off like a rocket. I could not believe what I saw next, the
wheel was straight and it was driving straight. I drove another 25 miles, stopped at
the car wash and I removed at least 5 pounds of dirt off The Ghost. I did a visual inspection
and started to find problems.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...QA1Frame/7.jpg

The air dam is damaged. Already received the new one.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...QA1Frame/8.jpg

The fog light worried me, I thought the bumper was bent or the whole set up was cracked.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...QA1Frame/9.jpg

:rofl: It was a rock between the light and the bumper, took it out and it snapped back in place.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/10.jpg

Deep scratches

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/11.jpg

Besides the passenger side floor panel, Do you see anything else?

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/12.jpg

Heat wrap broke

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/13.jpg

Tires were good with plenty of thread

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/14.jpg

I stopped looking , I sent Bryan a PM and he gave me few guidelines and what else
to look for and went back looking for anything that would not be right.

Yep, found damage to the passenger side shock tower. The coilover set up did not
brake, it bent the shock tower.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/15.jpg

Driver side

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/16.jpg

I spoke with Van Steel yesterday and he told me to take the whole thing out and inspect
for cracks or anything else that might have been damaged. This is how it looks without the coilover.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/17.jpg

Another driver side

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/18.jpg

Well found few things there. The top of the coilover is not damage and it impressed
me how this aluminum part bent the frame upwards.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/19.jpg

No cracks, no bends

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/20.jpg

Kaboom, Bad News- I compressed the shock and it didnt expand and even though it
doesnt look bent the shocks main body was rubbing against the coil.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/21.jpg

This is the GPS tracker database. Note how I jumped off the road and back on that
angle about 5 feet from the road.

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...A1Frame/22.jpg

I put The Ghost on the lift and measured the way Bryan guided me and it was dead on.
It amazed me how strong this frame is. Note that I have the Camber Brace installed
and I bet the rigidity it offers helped to keep this bad boy in place.

Here I go again, more money to find to get this coilover replaced. If this goes
overboard, I still have the monospring set-up in my LTX Crate.

Wow Pete, that could have been a lot worse. Lucky there wasn't a tree or something to greet you when you left the road. I've done the same thing before just never in a car that I cared much about. Glad your OK.

Looked like there was a telephone pole in this pic that you missed:

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...RUNS/COR/6.jpg

Pete was showing me the damage on Sunday, and I could not believe it either: how the car was able to drive after that excursion, and only damage to the shock tower (visual inspection only).

Contrary to how these things feel and act sometimes... they are tough mofos. :yesnod:


Hopefully that shock won't hurt the wallet too bad.

well, you kissed the corner of the oil pan, but it's nowhere near the pickup screen- wouldn't do anything with it until the engine comes out someday.


I drove over a curb real hard one night w my old '95. it scratched up the bottom real good and I fiber-repaired part of the floor board, but it also did about damage to the skid bars and the air dam was pretty much done. Nothing else was damaged and it drove straight as it did before.

sometimes it helps to hit stuff fast because it pops up and bunny hops the initial obstacle.

Oh that one was there when I bought it :seasix:

http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/j...LT4/Oct126.jpg

Just admit it Pete, you just wanted to try some off roading:D Good to hear you didn't bang up the Ghost too badly:cert:

questions:

1) So the passenger side went off first? (you were really rotated then).

2) How you gonna bend the shock tower? heat and hammer, or cut it off and have a junkyard graft welded on?

Wow, Pete, that was quite a ride. It is a good thing you were O. K. Parts can be changed, people cannot:seasix:

So, when did you change your shorts? :leaving:

It is lucky you can do the checking yourself. :D

1. yes

2. debating that. Few people told me to leave it alone.

Honestly, once all stopped I was kinda excited and already planning into transplanting everything into Betty Boop. Remember, I thought it was totaled.

I've been thinking a lot about this... The more I look at the pics, the more I worry about going that route with it. If it wasn't a coil over setup I wouldn't worry at all. The shock is not actually integral to the structure of the suspension. As long as you get full travel and don't end up in a binding situation, you aren't changing anything at all.

With the coil-overs, that isn't the case. The shock/spring are on that same mount and it sees a lot more stress. They actually see a lot more stress than they were initially designed for.

The only question now is which way is stronger... fixing it, or leaving it as is? If you do attempt to fix it, you are either adding more bends, or introducing welds and cuts and drastically increasing the possibility for human error.

Driving it down the street should be zero concern. My hesitation would come if you start adding more stress, hard cornering, or even big bumps into the equation.

I would say thats damn good advice.:iagree:

I've looked at your pics over and over and if it were mine, I would get in there with a sledge hammer (no heat) and pound it back into place. After it was back where it should be, I would make a brace in the shape of an upside down U that fit over the top of it (with a hole in the top big enough that it wouldn't get in the way of the shock bolt. I would weld that in place and call it a day. I'd probably do both sides just so it looked the same...

Excuse my 3 minute drawing, but I think it gets the point across.

http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p...andom/18-2.jpg

http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p...ndom/Brace.jpg

Nice :seasix:

Bryan,

Im not doubting your advise. I keep hammering this on my head. If I pound it with a hammer, it will be all deformed (like Hokies 19" arms). If I use heat with a high temp torch (I have) would it weaken the tower?

The brace is a good idea and based on my driving style I must do that. I already know that every time I go out in The Ghost I break something. I make it home and I go thru the same phase "I got to slow the F down", it gets fixed and I go back out with the Riverside group ( a bunch of Z06) and hall ass again. Screw it, I dont do drugs, I dont play golf, I dont have a wife or child support.

I can go to the machine shop nearby and have the old man make the braces for me. He is good at it, he made the back brace for the rear coilovers and they are working great so far.

So Bryan, here is one for you. I tried the 3 lbs brass hammer, I only gave it a hard blow and didnt even move.

I mailed the coilover to Van Steel about an hour ago. I know this is going to be about $300-$500 MAX. I remove the drivers side and it is a good condition so Im keeping this one here. The braces, a welder to come over and do it in my garage. The air dam replica was $50, I would like to paint the front and lets hope the rack and pinion doesnt start to bother me later on in life.

Now you know why I couldn't go out on a COR run...I already got two tickets this summer and I know those boys play a little hard. One guy does all the videos and he posted a couple of us using the whole road and we got a ration of shit from all the armchair internet experts about all of that.

I did find out that a regular C6 can't pull hard enough at 80-120 mph to overtake my ZR-1:). Following a C6 Z06 is a little humbling though, isn't it? At least you crashed when nobody was looking.

When I curbed mine, I thought it was all busted up underneath too and was about ready to see what it felt like to get a DUI. The car was good- I rolled out- and that scared me enough to give up my Friday night drinking- or at least maintain a two beer limit.

As far as the shock tower, I guess I'd want to make sure the guy has a good 220v welder that will get the penetration into the frame to have a strong mount. The tires just hard blunt force dirt impact, you might be lucky and not even need to re-balance.

Well its all my fault. Like I said earlier, I was over confident. The video that Sweet posted few weeks ago on the ZR1 the driver slowed down to 59 MPH to take a similar set of curves.

C6 ZR1 > Ghost

Michelin Pilot Sport Cup > Eagle F1 GS-D3

Professional Driver > PLRX

Track Condition > Low Life County Back Road

Professional Drivers Balls < PLRXs Balls

I know if I was driving that ZR1 I would have taken it at least at 70 MPH :D

Van Steel is great. He wants all details because he can tune the coilover for better grip. :seasix:

I would put a piece of wood... 2x6 or something along those lines on top of the tower and wail that son of a b*tch with a sledge (not a 3 pounder). The wood will hit the vertical supports and stop it from going too far down.

... as far as heating it goes, I would not. Cold working metal keeps the properties the same. Hot working does not. If you want to get in there and add a LITTLE heat, you should be ok, but adding enough to make a big difference in the malleability of the metal isn't something I would do.

noted