We shouldn't deport illegal aliens...
 

because it's unfair to punish them for what their parents did?

But I'm on the hook for slavery and Jim Crow because of the actions of long-dead people totally unrelated to me.

Got it.

:waiting:

Legalize the Dreamers, just as soon as they prove that their illegal alien parents who broke the law by bringing them here have left the country for good. Prevent them from daisy chaining those same parents and relatives back into the US.

Also, I'll need to see a COMPLETED border wall, end of birthright citizenship for children born here to foreigners, mandatory e-verify, and vastly increased resources for deportation, as well as a complete elimination of sanctuary cities.

If Congress isn't willing to do that, then send the Dreamers home, to make their own countries great.

I'm not talking about DACA, I'm talking about the end goal, which is getting them citizenship, and I think Trump is OK with that. I think the majority of Americans are OK with that, but this go-round, the people want to know that this is the last time illegal immigration has to be hashed out, that there won't be hordes of new illegals sneaking in and we won't be having this same conversation in another 30 years.

....which is why I mentioned all that stuff.

I think what he is trying to say is that DACA is essentially putting the cart before the horse...

Which has everything to do with the current DACA situation. Trump is forcing Congress to start doing its job, and holding a fairly sympathetic group hostage to do so. DACA was set to sunset all on its own anyway, without Trump lifting a finger. Trump gave the patently unconstitutional program another 6 months to wrap up.

Trump asked nicely. Now he's using extortion to get Congress to bend the knee on the border wall, outlawing sanctuary cities, and all other things illegal immigration related. Finally, middle class nobody, member of no special interest victim group Bill, has someone fighting for the things he wants.

http://www.publicseminar.org/wp-cont...elsgoodman.png

Heavily invested my ass. The heavily invested folks would have left the country and applied to come back legally. The rest of the ****s are stealing social security number (identity theft) or working under the table (tax evasion) and are criminals and should be treated as such. Any employer caught with employees they know are using illegal social security numbers, or are paying employees under the table should be fined to the brink of going out of business, they're stealing from all of us when they do that.

Do I think we should make it easier for hard working immigrants to come to get country and work? Yup, but that doesn't mean they can simply ignore the laws as they are written today.

Do I think we should raise or eliminate the speed limit on most highways? Yes, but that doesn't mean I can Double the posted speed limit without being arrested.

OK, so where do you draw the line on the people that BROKE THE LAW TO GET INTO THE COUNTRY?

It's a big kick in the teeth to the folks that are doing it LEGALLY to get into our country to allow "line jumpers" an easy pass.

There are laws in this country and we don't get to pick and choose which ones we would like to obey. ( without concern of repercussions )

Ah, but there's the rub. Trump is screwing no one. Trump is restoring the rule of law by phasing out the fiction of an unconstitutional edict, so he has the law on his side, and if Congress fails to act, that's on Congress, not on Trump, and not even on the deplorables that voted for Trump. Blame Obama for getting the Dreamers' hopes up in the first place.

You want this thing? How much do you want it? If Congress doesn't permanently fix immigration this time, I guess they (and by extension, all the people that voted for those Congress critters) didn't want it as much as you did. If this doesn't get done, there will be blame enough for all to go around.....not the least of which will be to the illegal alien parents who brought them here in the first place. People act like these folks accidentally got caught on the wrong side of the border through absolutely no fault of their own. No. They gambled that breaking the law would work out for them, and thus far, it has.

Talk about an inconvenient truth....

Sucks to be them.

They knew this day would come, yet did nothing to help their cause.

:kimblair:

Huh? All that protesting didn't help?

https://libertasintel.files.wordpres...pg?w=648&h=327

Such fine upstanding "wanna be" citizens :rolleyes:

Actions have consequences and it's not a good idea to aggravate the gate keeper.

Uhh the requirment was that theyre you were under 31 and had been here since before you were 16.

So am i to assume the dreamers were all indigents, never drove a car (with no license and no insurance) never had a job, and never contributed what so ever to the society that youre trying to claim they are so "heavily invested" in? Cause if they did any of the above, they are criminals, by their own actions, NOT their parents.

I get it i get it, you want to pretend that were just talking about innocent kids that have peacefully existed in the country for years.

The problem, is those kids have been here for years skirting and breaking laws, as well as consuming resources that have been funded by hard working legal residence.

its not fair to give the "dreamers" a leg up over those that chose to do everything by the letter of the law. The dreamers need to go, as in leave the country, pay back the resources they consumed (public schools and more) pay a fine, yes punitive, amd reapply for entry.

This is actually complete nonsense, because I most certainly do. And every single one of them that I know is

COMPLETELY PISSED

About what is going on with immigration in this country.


FWIW, these people are Russian, Filipino and Chinese respectively.


My wife just hired a LEGAL immigrant from the Czech Republic also, I don't know her politics, but at least she is LEGAL. (Green Card, etc) :island14:

How would you feel if you busted your ass to be a legal citizen only to have some leach get away with whatever they wanted?

And that's where you're not seeing the whole picture. I didn't say these folks had been arrested for caught breaking the law. I simply said the only way they functioned in society at all was by breaking the law willfully. All of these dreamers are over 16 (had to be to apply) are none of them working? Driving? Contributing to their family?

The only benefit I've mentioned has been public schools, and either these kids were in public school. Public school alone is a massive burden on the local authorities and schools.

Not to mention (slight assumption here) they probably wound up in the hospital a time or two as they likely don't have health insurance. I have a pretty good feeling they didn't pay much if anything for those services received.

My point is, however innocent you try to paint these dreamers they know they're here illegally and have had to break laws as a result. Simply by being here they're showing complete disregard for our system of laws. Regardless if they have a record or not.

In one statement you say most are contributing members of society, and the other you say they're minors.

Waco, my entire point is they're functioning in society. The point is they aren't functioning/contributing anything without breaking laws. If they're working or even likely getting loans they had to use fake social security numbers. If they're driving unless in California (and that's only recently) they don't have a legal drivers license. That's my whole point of this, you have adults who have made their own choice to break or continue to break the laws of our country.

No no no no that's only after they got granted Obamas Daca status. I'm arguing they're not entitled to any status or special privilege in the first place.

DACAs only been around a few years, what were these folks doing before daca. ....breaking the law.

Bullshit, 70+% of them are druggers....in a gang or jails at our expense....

:issues:

Having a D/L is just a damn joke in this nation, even here in Florida they get by with even murder on the roads, and the .gov will NOT investigate them one damn bit....cops refuse to do anything, no investigations, NOTHING.....

let a member of your family get hit and hospital and the illegals walk every effing time......hit and run, crews full of illegals that speak NO ENGLISH.....right there you know they not citizens, period end of conversation on that topic.....

get rear ended by someone with little to no coverage....get slammed by someone hit and run, friggin' illegal bitch with 3 kids in the car take your truck out and walk away, I wish the entire group in their car was killed at least we not be paying their .gov checks every damn month.....

Nah, I had it with this illegal shit here, up to me, I"d shoot every one of them without batting an eye.....dead serious.....

they are nothing but an invading army, sponsored by communists...and we know who they mascaraed as.....let alone any from islam.....:issues:

I Know more than you do, because this household has been handed the shit end of the stick THREE TIMES in the last 5 years due to ILLEGALS and their driving shit.....that's TWO pickup trucks and my wife's car with her going to the ER after hit in the rear at 45 mph....while at a stupid light, which is another topic.....

:issues:

THE HELL IT DONT.......just because YOU fail to see the cause and effect of their ILLEGAL presence in this country, don't mean I fail to see it when it's right in front of my face.....and taking precious $$$$ out of our household....

BULLSHIT!! U trying to justify some 30 million illegals in this country, the vast majority of which are on .gov aide of SOME kind or other, and spend their time either doing roofs or dealing drugs.....take your choice.....

DACA is just another .gov excuse for them being here in the first place....and thee IS no excuse that makes any sense at ALL.....liberals love to trade semantics and bullshit reasons, trying to confuse the issue......

:issues:

Maybe so. It appears the record comes a little after it is granted.

Yes, I do.

BTW: I wonder what is to be done with the PARENTS of the poor, defenseless children the proponents of DACA seem so concerned about. THEY, are also illegal aliens.

We saw how this worked in '86. Amnesty+zero promised enforcement or shutting down the border to illegal crossers, combined with daisy chaining of the extended family.

We need to have a very specific red line this time. If we give "dreamers" green cards and a path to citizenship, they need to prove that their illegal alien parents who bought them here have gone home, and they don't get to come back. Ever. The "dreamers" can go back to the old country if they want to visit their parents.

Liberal pukes sure have a hard time understanding common English!

The words illegal (Border jumpers) and infringed (gun grabbers) mean absolutely nothing to them.

Sent those illegal bastards back across the border. Please take schumer, pilossi hillary and mc cain with you, the country will smell much better!

I still would like to see them ALL go back to wherever they came from. If they truly want to become AMERICAN citizens, there are specific paths to follow.

Simple as that.

Now that everyone has offered their opinions, please read this quote and link:

As many as half of the approximately 800,000 people who now have work permits under DACA may have lied on their applications to get approved, said Matt O’Brien, an attorney and until last year a manager in the investigative unit of the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Service (USCIS).

USCIS employees did quick checks of DACA applications, he said, rather than thorough reviews, "in order to get the DACAs all racked and stacked quickly."

He and the investigators working under him, called adjudicators, often found evidence that someone had lied about his DACA qualifications, but the office of the chief counsel at USCIS, he said, almost always dismissed the adjudicator's recommendation to deny the application.

"I would say 98 percent of the time, they defaulted to approving them," he said.

it often happened that someone applying for DACA would have several adult children, making it virtually impossible for the person to have been 30 or under in 2012.

In other cases, he said, it appeared that documents were forged, or that non-existent schools were listed.

But these people were almost always approved anyway, said O'Brien, because of the attitude of managers in the field and the chief counsel's office.

"USCIS never verified anything people put on their DACA applications," she said, pointing to the case of Emmanuel Jesus Rangel-Hernandez, an illegal immigrant with gang affiliations who was granted DACA status and went on to murder four people in Charlotte, North Carolina. USCIS admitted in this case that it hadn't done any checks on the information Rangel-Hernandez had provided on his DACA application, but simply accepted the information on its face.

The approval rate for DACA in the two most recent quarters of fiscal year 2017 was approximately 97 percent, with only 3 percent of applications denied.

Relationship to USCIS is in this link, along with the complete story:

Fmr. USCIS Investigator: There's a 'Huge' Amount of Fraud in DACA | LifeZette

My, my, my.

Dishonest illegal aliens?

:kimblair:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-yLMCWIB2kL...%2Bkicking.gif

That may be, but they can get a record after the fact...

As Attorney General Jeff Sessions announced the end of the Obama-created Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA), from which more than 800,000 un-vetted young illegal aliens have been given protected status and work permits, the number of them who are convicted criminals, gang members, or suspects in crimes remains staggering.
Below, Breitbart News has compiled a list of 50 of the 2,139 DACA recipients, deemed “DREAMers” by the open borders lobby, who have had their temporary protected status revoked due to crimes including: “A felony criminal conviction; a significant misdemeanor conviction; multiple misdemeanor convictions; gang affiliation; or arrest of any crime in which there is deemed to be a public safety concern,” according to the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS) agency.

The majority of crimes by DACA recipients include: “Alien smuggling, assaultive offenses, domestic violence, drug offenses, DUI, larceny and thefts, criminal trespass and burglary, sexual offenses with minors, other sex offenses and weapons offenses,” USCIS has stated.

DREAMer Who Killed Two Girls in Hit-and-Run Won’t Be Deported

Cinthya Garcia-Cisneros, an illegal alien protected by DACA, was convicted in 2014 of two counts of felony hit and run after she killed two Forest Grove, Oregon, stepsisters — Anna Dieter-Eckerdt and Abigail Robinson ages 6 and 11 respectively — who were playing at the time of the incident, as Breitbart News reported.

A judge also threw out Garcia-Cisneros’ deportation case after her murder conviction.

Illegal Arrested for Child Sex-Abuse Was Protected By Obama’s Migrant Amnesty

Breitbart News reported in January 2016:

The illegal immigrant who was arrested this week in Arizona for a sex crime against a three-year old girl, was being shielded from repatriation by President Barack Obama’s 2012 ‘Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals’ program, according to the Senate Judiciary Committee.

The little girl was found Monday, while duct-taped, inside a trash bag, and covered in feces in a closet in an apartment occupied by Francisco Rios-Covarrubias. He was charged with kidnapping, sexual conduct with a minor, felony child abuse, and sex trafficking. The child’s mother was also arrested.

DREAMer Murdered American Teen in Sanctuary City

Laura Wilkerson explained what occurred to her son, Josh, at the hands of an illegal alien protected by DACA in 2013, Breitbart News reported:

We found out later that what he [Hermilio Moralez] did was he asked Josh for a ride home from school and Josh said, ‘sure,’” Wilkerson said. “I think he’d given him a ride home two or three times before. He took him actually to his parents’ house. For some reason, we found out later why, what he did to Josh was he hit him in the nose, and this is what the kid tells from the stand, he hit him in the nose so hard that it would blind him so that he couldn’t fight back. Then he kicked him so hard in the stomach. Josh was about this big around and he weighed about 100 pounds in the body bag. He kicked him so hard in the stomach that his liver sliced in two and his spine sliced in two. He ruptured his spleen. He took a closet rod and beat Josh over the head so hard with it that it broke in four pieces. He strangled him, then let him go. Strangled him, let him go. Per the medical examiner, it was just torturous. After he murdered him, as he said, when Josh quit having bloody bubbles come out of his nose, he knew he was gone, he tied him up like an animal with about 13 ropes from his the back of his neck to the back of his hands, to the back of his feet. He covered his head with his school shirt. Then he put him in the back of my son’s truck and he drove around and he took two dollars out of Josh’s wallet and he stopped and bought gas. Then he took him to a field and he took his wallet and school ID out and just placed it by the body. Then he doused him with gas and set him on fire. It was just incredible.

DREAMer Accused of Raping Woman in Sanctuary City

Salvador Diaz-Garcia, 23, is facing second-degree assault and rape charges for an alleged brutal attack on a 19-year-old woman in Burien, Washington, Breitbart Texas reported.

According to court documents, the woman was on a treadmill at her local gym when Garcia allegedly stood behind her and asked her questions. The woman said she asked Garcia to move. Garcia allegedly attacked the woman, breaking her jaw and nose, and ripping half of her ear off.

Father of Murdered Florida Mother Reveals Suspected Killer Was DACA Recipient

Curt is the father of Kelsey Engelsen, the 24-year-old woman who was allegedly murdered outside a bar by alleged DACA recipient and convicted felon Carlos Ruben Rodriguez, 24-years-old, as Breitbart News reported.

As previously reported by FOX 4 Now, Rodriguez has been charged with second-degree murder following the incident in which he and another man were allegedly in a fight. Witnesses say that’s when Rodriguez began allegedly shooting, killing Engelsen, and wounding another woman, Cassandra Santos.

Three DREAMers Arrested in Nationwide Gang Crackdown

Three illegal alien gang members arrested in an ICE operation back in May had protected status under the Obama-era DACA program. Since DACA’s inception, more than 1,500 illegal immigrants saw their protected status revoked after they were found to be involved with a gang or committed a crime, Breitbart Texas reported.

DREAMer Allegedly Helped Drag Queen Smuggle Illegal Aliens in Texas

Juan Valdez Molina, an illegal alien protected by DACA, was accused by Texas authorities of helping a drag queen smuggle illegal aliens across the U.S.-Mexico Border, Breitbart Texas reported. For his alleged part in the human smuggling conspiracy, Valdez was expected to be paid $1,000.

23 Amnesty Recipients Arrested In Nationwide Crime Sweep

Breitbart News reported in March 2015:

Of 2,059 criminal immigrants arrested in a recent nationwide sweep, 23 were beneficiaries of President Obama’s 2012 amnesty, or the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program, according to DHS.

The nearly two dozen illegal immigrants had been shielded from deportation by DACA, and while all 23 had been part of the program eight failed to get their status renewed, meaning that 15 of the arrested criminal aliens were current DACA recipients, the Washington Times reported Thursday.

15 DREAMers Arrested for ‘Dangerous’ Crimes

According to an Associated Press report, “federal agents in a sweep targeting the most dangerous criminal immigrants arrested 15 people” who received temporary amnesty, Breitbart News reported in 2015.

A U.S. official who was briefed on the arrests told the Associated Press that 14 “of the 15 had been convicted of a crime.”

DREAMer Faces Deportation after Drug Allegations

Juan Manuel Martinez, 19, will soon become one of a few DACA recipients who will be deported back to his native country after run-ins with the law, Breitbart Texas reported in May.

Earlier this year, Martinez was arrested for drug possession after Monterey County sheriff’s deputies found meth and marijuana in his vehicle. Martinez was also charged with trespassing, which he later pleaded no contest to.

DREAMer Arrested in Sexual Predator Sting near Texas Border

Hernandez-Rodas, an illegal alien protected by DACA, was charged with child sex crimes after he allegedly lured a 14-year-old girl, who ended up being a federal agent, into a hotel room for sex, Breitbart Texas reported.

DREAMer Deported to Mexico After Embezzlement Charges

Gus Zamudio, 18, returned to Mexico City nearly a month before he was expected to graduate from art school, Breitbart Texas reported in May.

Zamudio allegedly embezzled approximately $3,000 from Harris Teeter, the grocery store he was working for in February, according to police. Zamudio’s attorney pleaded down the felony charges, but the illegal immigrant remained in law enforcement custody.

John Binder is a reporter for Breitbart Texas. Follow him on Twitter at @JxhnBinder.

And I guess all that is a baaaaad thing?!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No, I'm complaining about the damage and carnage this "elite" group of ILLEGALS has performed.

The claims that these are a better class are complete bullshit.

Since it is believable that only 2100 were ACTUALLY checked, it's not much to be proud of...

All righty then. There are alternatives. :yesnod:

Trump should make an offer to the Dems.

He will offer conditional amnesty to all Dreamers who do not have criminal records and say crime free and productive ( that means working and paying taxes) for 5 years.

BUT

The congress has to pass a law ending birth right citizenship to children born to people not legally allowed in the USA.

Well maybe we could focus on the LEGAL general public if we weren't distracted by 12+- million that don't belong here.

12+?? more like 30 million.......:sadangel:

They're working on it.

:iagree:

It's around 11.1 million

How Pew Research Center estimates illegal immigration | Pew Research Center

Yet we have 67 Million collecting means tested welfare.
Welfare Statistics and Demographics – Statistic Brain

Many are collecting simply because thier business don;t have to pay them more because the illegals are deflating the wages of the lower class.

It's time to get the illegals out of the USA and the people on welfare off thier butts and getting paid market wages.

The best way to reduce illegal immigration is to end birth right citizenship and reduce all means tested welfare by 30-50%. Watch how fast the America people kick the illegals out when they start to starve.

Seems like every run of the mill commoner and nobody I talk to recognizes this, but our elected leaders not only do nothing, they don't even give lip service to it. Even Trump, with his great bully pulpit, is virtually mute on this issue. Now is the time, and the DACA fight is the hill that this fight needs to be won on.

As I've said before trump should offer to given the non criminal dreamers conditional amnesty if they stay crime free and gainfully employed for the next 5 years.

But

Demand Birth right citizenship end for anyone born to people who are not legally in the USA.

:iagree:X10000

My Mom and Grandmother and that entire side of the family did it that way, and they came out of FAR worse circumstances than these so-called "dreamers."

No sympathy or empathy here. Follow the law, do it right, or don't do it.

THAT YOU KNOW OF, that is....:dance::sadangel:

My GP's came over in 1895, teenagers, I guess their folks saw the shit hitting the fan over there and encouraged them to :dance: on out while room to :dance:

Much like the inability to understand "illegal" I guess "undocumented" is also a mystery term.

"Ok all illegal aliens, please form a single file line and register here so we know how many of you there are" :funnier:

If you and your parents snuck into Disney World. Who is to blame when Disney catches you and evicts you from the park?

It's not disneys fault, it's likely your parents fault and no Disney doesn't owe you another single ride.

I really DGAS if it is off by 1 person. I don't care if the 11M number is double the real number. Regardless of how many, they need to be GONE !

No Mercy for "Dreamers" unless we get our border wall, an end to birthright citizenship, a repeal of the Hart–Celler Act, a permanent bar on any welfare of any kind to immigrants, etc., etc., etc.

Reagan was a nice guy and let people stay. California IMMEDIATELY transformed from a reliable red state in POTUS elections to a blue state, and by 2016 the GOP candidate for POTUS literally got doubled-up 8 million to 4 million votes.

No more anchor babies, and no more immigrants who are not already fluent in English and who do not have a skill that is (a) in short supply here, and (b) enables them to provide for themselves. No more effing foreign tech workers to get trained by American workers who then get ****-canned either.

Oh, and NO admission for any dreamer to ANY University that receives federal funding. Private schools can do what they want, NO taking a spot at any state university and denying an actual American citizen that spot.

And most importantly of all NO voting rights EVER for ANYONE who came to this country illegally.

Do all that and maybe I'll give a rats behind about the Dreamers. For now, I'm a bit more concerned with every AMERICAN who has taken it and will take it in the @$$ someway, somehow, because of Illegal immigrants and illegal immigration, and while we're on the immigration subject visa program abuse as well.

.gov claims 12, I hear much closer to 30 megs.....and so 12x2= 25 megs, conversationally, since no one has a REAL count due to .gov incompetence.....

or political crap.....takes your pick.....

I say look at the welfare rolls.....that tells the tale....how many latina last names per house?? THAT plus a FAIR/HONEST estimate of how much factual WORK is getting done, and no SS payments/etc.....

much less how many ILLEGALS get a driver license?? 20 years ago I had to sent do Glen Burnie Faryland to get a copy of my BIRTH cert to get a Florida d/l......pardon ME but it was lost in 50 years+ NOW if they demand I get a CERT that I"m alive....why not the ILLEGALS and their offspring????

anything different than MY train of thought is pure bullshit.....I"m correct and I damn well KNOW it.....

:issues:

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Not sure how you really feel about this.

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