View Full Version : Heated 02's another legitimate c4 thread
I installed heated 02's on my car and they don't seem to be working. I was wondering if anyone has done this mod before. I could be wrong but I assumed the heated 02's should go into closed loop much quicker. The sensors seem to be working according to a datalog but I see no evidence that the sensors are heating. Here is what I did.
The parts
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00672.jpg
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00673.jpg
Plugged them together and marked the harness wire that goes to the blue 02 wire.
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00676.jpg
Cut a harness plug from an old 02 sensor.
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00677.jpg
Pulled the metal part out of connectors to use on the solderless connections.
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00674.jpg
Made the connection and had heat shrink ready to slide into place.
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00678.jpg
Used high heat silicone to give it that little extra moisture resistance before heating the shrink tape.
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00679.jpg
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00681.jpg
Used painless high heat 16 ga wire to run for the 12v hot and ground wires. Finished building the harness using black conduit to cover the wires
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00682.jpg
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00683.jpg
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00692.jpg
Topside the wires come out just under the wiper motor where I am pulling the switched 12v source.
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00689.jpg
See the brown wire that I pulled back the insulation just enough to wrap a piece of wire around. I cut a 1' piece of the painless wire and pulled back the insulation on it then twisted it around the brown wire and dabbed it with solder then wrapped with black tape.
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00688.jpg
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00695.jpg
Used plug type connectors to connect the 12v source to the new harness wires. And connected the ground to the fuel rail cover stud. I figured a ground to the engine would work well.
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00697.jpg
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00698.jpg
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii316/tuffLUV_photos/383%20build/Heated%2002%20install%20on%2093/DSC00699.jpg
Bill,
Did you get the engine light on or a code?
Lets try this again.
Disconnect the battery for few minutes. Start the Vette and let it idle for 10 minutes. Drive it around, shut the engine and do another test.
Bill,
Did you get the engine light on or a code?
Lets try this again.
Disconnect the battery for few minutes. Start the Vette and let it idle for 10 minutes. Drive it around, shut the engine and do another test.
Pete, There were no codes before or after. I did allow the battery to run completely down because I forgot to unplug the underhood lights (this project was started over a week ago) so I had to charge it before starting.
Why would driving it allow the heaters to get hot?
Pete, There were no codes before or after. I did allow the battery to run completely down because I forgot to unplug the underhood lights (this project was started over a week ago) so I had to charge it before starting.
Why would driving it allow the heaters to get hot?
I've never done this mod. I have regular O2 sensors on both Vettes. If you got no codes; Why do you think they are not working?
The 12v source I used should have been switched, so key on and the heaters should start warming. When I finished I turned the key on and checked the temp (using a temp gun) on the header collector where they were installed. There was no heat change but I thought maybe the heaters are small enough to not radiate heat that far. So I went ahead and connected the computer and started the car and datalog. My car does not go into closed loop very easy and will take several minutes which is one of the reasons I did the mod. There was no change. If fact when the car did go into closed loop it went straight to split BLMs. I think maybe this is why you wanted me to run the car. I'm not going to worry about the BLMs until I can get some drive time in.
I don't see enough duct tape.:toetap:
I don't see enough duct tape.:toetap:
Crap, I knew I forgot something. And the hammer I used was too small too.
Pete K
08-05-2012, 10:08am
I would relocate the ground wire to the chassis, near the battery. There is a ground cluster over there.
I would relocate the ground wire to the chassis, near the battery. There is a ground cluster over there.
Pete, I should have checked the voltage at the new harness plugs at the sensors. I'll also give your suggestion a try. Do you know if the heaters should produce enough heat to feel it on the pipes?
Pete K
08-05-2012, 12:00pm
Pete, I should have checked the voltage at the new harness plugs at the sensors. I'll also give your suggestion a try. Do you know if the heaters should produce enough heat to feel it on the pipes?
I am not sure. My heated sensor will normally allow the car to go into closed loop pretty quickly though. I never had luck grounding to aluminum, so I am hoping a chassis ground will fix you right up.
I am not sure. My heated sensor will normally allow the car to go into closed loop pretty quickly though. I never had luck grounding to aluminum, so I am hoping a chassis ground will fix you right up.
Didn't know about the aluminum ground issue. I will try it and the chassis ground behind the battery. That sucks too, it looks so purdy and was convenient where I put it.
Vette40th
08-05-2012, 12:43pm
I grounded mine to the chassis. I also watch the engine on TTS Datamaster and after 90 seconds it goes into closed loop. I have the 3 wire sensors, and long tubes on my 93. Remember, it is .1 volt. Grounds are very important.
I grounded mine to the chassis. I also watch the engine on TTS Datamaster and after 90 seconds it goes into closed loop. I have the 3 wire sensors, and long tubes on my 93. Remember, it is .1 volt. Grounds are very important.
I connected the 2 black wires to a 12 volt source and a ground. If by .1 volt your talking about the sensor. Except for the heater part, the 02 sensor actually seems to be working normal (as compared to the regular 1 wire). I'm using Tunerpro RT and the sensors are flashing back and forth between 900 and 100 mv.
Vette40th
08-05-2012, 2:52pm
I connected the 2 black wires to a 12 volt source and a ground. If by .1 volt your talking about the sensor. Except for the heater part, the 02 sensor actually seems to be working normal (as compared to the regular 1 wire). I'm using Tunerpro RT and the sensors are flashing back and forth between 900 and 100 mv.
Looks good then. As long as it goes into closed loop, that is the main reason heated O2's are put in Long Tubes. Should be about 90 seconds after starting.
I used the AIR pump source and grounded on chassis grounds on frame.
The .1 volt is so small, and with bad grounds, it can cause a O2 to send bad data to the ECM. Yours seems to be good.
Looks good then. As long as it goes into closed loop, that is the main reason heated O2's are put in Long Tubes. Should be about 90 seconds after starting.
I used the AIR pump source and grounded on chassis grounds on frame.
The .1 volt is so small, and with bad grounds, it can cause a O2 to send bad data to the ECM. Yours seems to be good.
I agree about the sensor info going to the ECM, it's the heaters that are seemingly not working. My old 1 wire 02's were working the same but I was hoping, besides going into closed loop much quicker, that it would be more responsive with the data if the sensor maintained a steadier temp. I have been fighting this BLM problem ever since I put in the new motor. I had been making some improvements but still not good. BLM's were all over the place from 160 to 110, the left side being high and the right side being low. Yesterday I went for a run to see what the readings were going to be. From the start, the second it finally went into closed loop (which took several minutes) the left side went straight to 160 and the right side to 145.
Vette40th
08-05-2012, 4:27pm
I agree about the sensor info going to the ECM, it's the heaters that are seemingly not working. My old 1 wire 02's were working the same but I was hoping, besides going into closed loop much quicker, that it would be more responsive with the data if the sensor maintained a steadier temp. I have been fighting this BLM problem ever since I put in the new motor. I had been making some improvements but still not good. BLM's were all over the place from 160 to 110, the left side being high and the right side being low. Yesterday I went for a run to see what the readings were going to be. From the start, the second it finally went into closed loop (which took several minutes) the left side went straight to 160 and the right side to 145.
Once you are in closed loop, the heaters have done their job. As far as the ultimate goal of better BLMs, forgeta 'bout it.
J/K. I have been fighting BLM issues for years. Once off idle they are fine. There are aso many tricks, suggestions, etc etc. I just gave up. I have had at least 7 different well respected tuners try to fix my BLMs. I even did the drill modification on the manifolds idle circuits under the LT1 manifold. No joy. The manifold, along with a camshafts duration just causes reversion, and the sensors just see something that makes it adjust the BLMS accordingly.
I have been to Camaro tuners, sites, Corvette tuners and all respective sites. OCD and unless you have a 94-96, you just cant tune each cylinder. If you look at the tables for each cylinder in a 94-96, since they have sequential injection, vice batch fire, they are able to alter pulse widths on each injector for idle. We cant in 92/93 LT1's for example.
Once you are in closed loop, the heaters have done their job. As far as the ultimate goal of better BLMs, forgeta 'bout it.
J/K. I have been fighting BLM issues for years. Once off idle they are fine. There are aso many tricks, suggestions, etc etc. I just gave up. I have had at least 7 different well respected tuners try to fix my BLMs. I even did the drill modification on the manifolds idle circuits under the LT1 manifold. No joy. The manifold, along with a camshafts duration just causes reversion, and the sensors just see something that makes it adjust the BLMS accordingly.
I have been to Camaro tuners, sites, Corvette tuners and all respective sites. OCD and unless you have a 94-96, you just cant tune each cylinder. If you look at the tables for each cylinder in a 94-96, since they have sequential injection, vice batch fire, they are able to alter pulse widths on each injector for idle. We cant in 92/93 LT1's for example.
Well that's depressing:D. Caboboy (Tim) has been helping me and says that he has his under control. BUT, his is an L98 not LT1 so maybe there are differences he isn't aware of. I found where the muffler shop that last worked on my car did a sh!tty job of fitting the pipe coming out of my collector so I may have had a leak there. I worked in some High temp silicone and retightened the band clamp. It may have helped because I made another run today and the BLMs were much better.
For everyone who tried to help. It turns out the brown wire I tapped into is only hot with 12 volts when unplugged. Yep, when I tested the voltage on my new 02 harness plug I was only getting 1.3 Volts so I unplugged the wiper motor plug and checked it again and 12 volts. I'm scratching my head. I plug it back in and run a needle through the wire and whodda thunkit 1.3 volts. The are 2 harness plugs in the wiper motor so I check the wires on other and found a 12 volt switched wire there. We are working now, started the car and 90 seconds later, closed loop.
Now we'll see if I sealed my new opti well enough. When I got back to the house and popped the hood I was hit with antifreeze. I blew the 3/4" hose that goes into the throttle body and it was spraying all over the front of the engine.:confused5:
Vette40th
08-05-2012, 8:04pm
SOunds like you are working now.
The LT1 manifold is a fancy little bread box. It doesnt separate the cylinders like an L98 does. There are many threads about BLM split. Google, sit down with a note pad, and have some coffee.
SOunds like you are working now.
The LT1 manifold is a fancy little bread box. It doesnt separate the cylinders like an L98 does. There are many threads about BLM split. Google, sit down with a note pad, and have some coffee.
Yeah, I have had a taste of googling split BLMs before. It's overwhelming to say the least. Thanks for the help.
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