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C5Nate
06-05-2012, 6:39pm
Sorry I couldnt come up with a title worthy of onedef on this one.

A WTF as in, why would you make a sculpture of this? :rofl:


Sculpture incites debate: Is it art or obscenity?
Nudity bothers critics who say sculpture in Overland Park Arboretum shouldn’t be seen by young visitors.


http://media.kansascity.com/smedia/2012/06/01/23/14/QYgY4.Em.81.jpeg

By ERIC ADLER
The Kansas City Star
By ERIC ADLER The Kansas City Star
Updated: 2012-06-02T05:31:47Z

One of the statues in the International Sculpture Garden at the Overland Park Arboretum has inspired some discontent. The statue "Choice" by Chinese artist Yu Chang includes anatomically correct female features.


One of the more curious aspects of controversial — or, perhaps, just bare-breasted — art, is this: People want to view it.

Which, amid a flurry of publicity, likely accounts for an uptick in attendance this week at the Overland Park Arboretum & Botanical Gardens on West 179th Street in the southern reaches of Johnson County.

Since November, the 300-acre nature garden has displayed along one of it wooded walking paths 11 life-size bronze sculptures that were created and donated to the arboretum by Chinese sculptors.

One of them, titled “Accept or Reject” by artist Yu Chang, presents the disjointed body of a young, bare-breasted woman, one thin arm extended to snap a photo of herself.

The sculpture so shocked a Stilwell mother, Joanne Hughes, who came upon it with her children in tow, that since May 9 she has been leading a campaign to have it hauled off to a more “appropriate venue” where children can’t be inadvertently exposed.

Calls to Overland Park’s mayor, city manager, council members, arboretum officials and others gave her no satisfaction.

“Not one of the people I talked to saw anything inappropriate about having that in front of children,” Hughes said this week. No plans to move the sculpture; no plans even to talk about moving the sculpture.
But the flap, along with an online petition initiated by Hughes, has done much to heighten interest in the arboretum. The garden, which gets about 130,000 visitors a year, keeps only loose numbers. Not everyone signs in as a visitor, but anecdotally, officials said, the place has been far busier than normal.

”We had a group of middle-aged men out there last Friday looking at it,” said Overland Park’s communications director Sean Reilly. “I can tell you that that’s not the typical demographic we see there. (DUH) Some people have come to the visitors’ center asking just to see that piece.”

This week, the city tried to address Hughes’ concerns by posting two signs at the entrances to the walking path that include a caution: “Some pieces include a display of the human body and parental guidance is encouraged.”
Unappeased, Hughes has joined forces with the Kansas and Missouri chapter of the American Family Association, whose national organization is based in Tupelo, Miss. In 1990, the association successfully worked to get a grand jury impaneled to indict Cincinnati’s Contemporary Arts Center for displaying what it considered obscene photographs by the late photographer Robert Mapplethorpe. A jury disagreed and acquitted the museum.

Starting Tuesday, Hughes and American Family local director Phillip Cosby plan to gather about 3,000 signatures from Overland Park residents to compel a Johnson County District Court judge to convene a grand jury to decide whether the arboretum should be indicted on obscenity charges. Regionally, the association in the past has used similar tactics to bring obscenity indictments against a number of businesses that sell pornographic videos or devices. A handful of those businesses did change their practices.

This is the first time the local group has taken on the issue of a public sculpture.

“What they’re calling art is what we’re saying is obscenity,” Cosby said. “They left us no recourse but to let the courts decide. It is the people’s call.”
Johnson County District Attorney Stephen Howe said he could not comment on any action by American Family. But in general, he said, proving something is “obscene” from a legal standpoint is very difficult.

By statute, Howe said, something can be deemed “obscene” only if it is shown to lack any serious literary, educational, artistic or scientific value.
“In general, across the country, with obscenity cases,” Howe said, “there is a very high standard to meet. The courts have always weighed very strongly on the side of freedom of speech.”

Hughes, who moved to the area about four years ago, said that over the past couple of weeks she has received both support and condemnation. Some people have called her “moron” and “idiot” and told her to “go back to your hole.”

“I’m not paying too much attention,” she said.
Her fight, she said, is to protect young children such as her own, although she conceded that while on their walk in the arboretum, her daughters, ages 4 and 2, never saw the sculpture.

“I saw it first,” said Hughes, who had been walking with her husband. “They were busy looking for snails on the ground. We ushered them past. But as a mom of two girls, especially, I don’t want them to have to see something like that.”

Hughes said that from her point of view, the depiction of a girl with naked breasts snapping a photo of herself seemed to glorify “sexting,” the practice of texting sexually provocative photos.

“With the problem of youth sexting right now in our culture,” she said, “I don’t even think we need to go there.”

The outdoor sculpture is not accompanied by any explanation of the artist’s intent, but published accounts of the sculpture insist that it was the opposite of Hughes’ interpretation. Rather than promoting sexting, the sculpture is meant to point out the danger of digital technology and social media — how in fragmenting individuals into separate parts, including their sexuality, people can lose part of their humanity and individuality. The fact that the woman in the sculpture has no head underscores this point.

“But that requires explanation,” Hughes said. “They don’t have anyone explaining that. There is no explanation given at the location. And besides, why should we have to explain that to a 4- or 5-year-old?”

No matter what the artist’s intent, she thinks the sculpture is, on the whole, “too mature for young eyes” and has the potential to expose children to difficult and unexpected images and force parents into conversations with children that they may not be ready to have.
“I didn’t take the time to understand the artist’s message,” Hughes said. “I was really thinking, ‘Good grief, what is that doing here?’ It is vulgar. It is provocative. I thought it was glorifying sexting. For me, it is very offensive.”

Hughes said she is not asking for the piece to be destroyed or hidden from public view. She thinks it needs to be in a museum or other more adult venue.
She rejects any argument that likens the arboretum sculpture to, say, naked figures from Greek or Roman antiquity or the works of Michelangelo or Rodin.
“I have seen the statue of David in person,” Hughes said of Michelangelo’s masterpiece. “It is beautiful. He’s also not taking a picture of his penis. There is a difference there. The message is different.”

Sarah VanLanduyt, executive director of the Arts Council of Johnson County, said she think the arboretum sculpture is doing exactly what public art is meant to do.
“The artwork is not meant to be pornographic. It is meant to spark this kind of conversation,” she said. “It’s meant to cultivate a very interesting dialogue.

Read more here: Sculpture incites debate: Is it art or obscenity? - KansasCity.com (http://www.kansascity.com/2012/06/01/3638165/sculpture-incites-debate-is-it.html#storylink=cpy)

carlton_fritz
06-05-2012, 6:41pm
Nice bewbs.

78SA
06-05-2012, 6:43pm
Art? No. Obscene? No? Inappropriate? Yes.

NEED-A-VETTE
06-05-2012, 6:50pm
It must be cold outside.

The_Dude
06-05-2012, 6:52pm
No one would complain in Portland.

carlton_fritz
06-05-2012, 6:55pm
How long until someone steals it?

bsmith
06-05-2012, 6:57pm
My first move as president would be to dissolve the National Endowment for the Arts.

DJ_Critterus
06-05-2012, 7:01pm
No cameltosis = not obscene

Craig
06-05-2012, 7:06pm
It must be cold outside.

Why, because of the evidence of brittle fracture?

lallend
06-05-2012, 7:07pm
Somebody should throw on a forest BDU shirt and attach a couple of babies to the tits and THEN, it would be art... :D

Kerrmudgeon
06-05-2012, 7:32pm
Once again a very small group of so called art experts spend tax payers money on what THEY think is art, and the public who has no say in it has to put up with it. It's hideous.......:slap:


In this era of multi social media it would very simple to take a poll and ask the public (payers) which piece of art should be selected from a number of choices. :toetap:

Sea Six
06-05-2012, 7:58pm
It must be cold outside.

I had a GF one time whose nipples were always hard. Always.

She had to wear padded bras all the time to hide it.

:)





Damn, I loved that girl. :seasix:

DJ_Critterus
06-05-2012, 8:09pm
Once again a very small group of so called art experts spend tax payers money on what THEY think is art, and the public who has no say in it has to put up with it. It's hideous.......:slap:


In this era of multi social media it would very simple to take a poll and ask the public (payers) which piece of art should be selected from a number of choices. :toetap:

Actually, it would be better to ask the public (those being fleeced) if they want to finance this shit in the first place.

Fastguy
06-05-2012, 8:13pm
I think it's a very cool sculpture.

Burro (He/Haw)
06-05-2012, 8:18pm
A WTF? Art or Obscenity?
You forgot one: WGAF.

A WTF as in, why would you make a sculpture of this?
I think it's pretty unique. I like it. :leaving:

As for the kids seeing it, I might get on board with that.

NeedSpeed
06-05-2012, 8:44pm
“I have seen the statue of David in person,” Hughes said of Michelangelo’s masterpiece. “It is beautiful. He’s also not taking a picture of his penis. There is a difference there. The message is different.”


That's only because they didn't have cameras back then.

Craig
06-05-2012, 8:51pm
That's only because they didn't have cameras back then.

And also, it was cold outside...

polarbear
06-05-2012, 10:21pm
No one would complain in Portland.

Or possibly even notice. We're all up in arms over the proposed compost policing initiative. The "Green Police" Audi joked about is about to become a reality.

island14
06-05-2012, 10:33pm
Nothing more the kids would see than with an undressed Barbie doll.. :island14:

What I think is obscene is how just a few can make a lot of noise out of something and then they make new rules and laws for everyone...

Can't say God anymore in schools, can't say Merry Christmas anymore, and the list of PC shit keeps getting bigger everyday....

HOWSER
06-05-2012, 11:37pm
I knew what it was before I even opened the thread.

My vote is art.

FasterTraffic
06-06-2012, 12:45am
Actually, it would be better to ask the public (those being fleeced) if they want to finance this shit in the first place.

I agree. Who should we ask first?

Since November, the 300-acre nature garden has displayed along one of it wooded walking paths 11 life-size bronze sculptures that were created and donated to the arboretum by Chinese sculptors.

FasterTraffic
06-06-2012, 12:53am
My vote is art.

:iagree:

One of the statues in the International Sculpture Garden...

Imagine that: Someone encounters a sculpture of the human form in a sculpture garden.

More to the point, it's the human body. That's it. Nothing more. A pair of breasts. BFD. Does that woman make her kids wear bathing suits in the bathtub?


:slap:

When someone cries, "Obscene!" I expect it to be a hardcore depiction of a homosexual sex involving Ronald McDonald, the Monopoly character with the monocle, and Jesus. Or what George Lucas did to the original "Star Wars" movies.

joecaver
06-06-2012, 4:03am
I think it'is cool. I don't understand why people would think that their children shouldn't see it. It has been a while since my children were young but I seem to remember them being born with nipples.

carlton_fritz
06-06-2012, 4:10am
Pics of the model?:waiting:

Joecooool
06-06-2012, 6:51am
A million barn bucks his inspiration was GGW on Reddit.

Yerf Dog
06-06-2012, 10:53am
When someone cries, "Obscene!" I expect it to be a hardcore depiction of a homosexual sex involving Ronald McDonald, the Monopoly character with the monocle, and Jesus. Or what George Lucas did to the original "Star Wars" movies.

:rofl::iagree:

Poog
06-06-2012, 11:12am
Art. Also, it was donated. Why the hell do people get all up in arms over this? Nudity and sex in this country are so fvcking demonized it's hilarious...but with the other hand EVERYTHING is violent and sex sells EVERYTHING.

We're such a fvcked up culture. :lol:

This.

Madmikeee
06-06-2012, 11:22am
neither, it's stupid.


There is no artistic value in that sculpture. I guarantee that this "artist" ,like so many others now, do these "pieces" just to spark debates of art or obscene, just like this one. That way they can get their 15 mins of fame.

Bucwheat
06-06-2012, 11:40am
You see nude statues in Europe all the time,they have no problem with it why should we,I think it's a little wierd but it's OK.

mrvette
06-06-2012, 1:25pm
You forgot one: WGAF.


I think it's pretty unique. I like it. :leaving:

As for the kids seeing it, I might get on board with that.

NEA, you favor PAYING for that?? I would HOPE not.....

:kick:

mrvette
06-06-2012, 1:41pm
NEA, you favor PAYING for that?? I would HOPE not.....

:kick:

Brings back a old memory, sometime in the later 60's, my Father and partners sold the company office building, just a old converted house, and rented office space in a high rise building.....the entrance lobby had this silly open space one of the first NEA 'sculptures' in it, going down about a story and up the same distance....so maybe 48' tall, holes in the floor about 25' around....

so there the put this gigantic POS without any possible meaning, just a bunch of steel plates welded on a pole to act like multi color leaves or some such....

ONE little issue, the plates used to break loose every once in a while, and land in the basement ......shattering the small pool at the base and letting water everywhere.....lovely....it was not a DEEP pool, so some semblance of sense, anyway.....

but they finally tossed it outta there because it was a safety hazard....so much for 'art' on the public dime.....

such is the wonderful 'gifts' of living in the DC burbs, seeing first hand the focups of the wonder expanded hippy culture funded on YOUR dime.....think for a nanosecond it's any better when spread across the land??? really??

:issues::kick:

Burro (He/Haw)
06-06-2012, 2:01pm
It's art. Just because you dont "Get it" doesn't make it less valid.

Heathens. :D

8Up
06-06-2012, 2:25pm
That depends, did it just finish breast feeding a gas can? OH LOL See what I did there... I meant BABY not gas can. LOL. Oh, I better just put the gas can in the car and go home.....baby.....I mean baby. :slap:

mrvette
06-06-2012, 2:33pm
It's art. Just because you dont "Get it" doesn't make it less valid.

Heathens. :D

YES IT DOES....

Valid? on YOUR DIME ALONE< NOT MINE!!!!!!

Burro (He/Haw)
06-06-2012, 2:57pm
YES IT DOES....

Valid? on YOUR DIME ALONE< NOT MINE!!!!!!

Calm the hell down you're gonna vapor lock!

C5Nate
06-06-2012, 3:53pm
I think it'is cool. I don't understand why people would think that their children shouldn't see it. It has been a while since my children were young but I seem to remember them being born with nipples.


I like it also, but I can see where some would be upset. See below.

Art. Also, it was donated. Why the hell do people get all up in arms over this? Nudity and sex in this country are so fvcking demonized it's hilarious...but with the other hand EVERYTHING is violent and sex sells EVERYTHING.

We're such a fvcked up culture. :lol:

:iagree:
Imagine that: Someone encounters a sculpture of the human form in a sculpture garden.

More to the point, it's the human body. That's it. Nothing more. A pair of breasts. BFD. Does that woman make her kids wear bathing suits in the bathtub?

:slap:
When someone cries, "Obscene!" I expect it to be a hardcore depiction of a homosexual sex involving Ronald McDonald, the Monopoly character with the monocle, and Jesus. Or what George Lucas did to the original "Star Wars" movies.


I like the statue (obviously) and plan to go see it soon.

The reason some are upset is because they feel it is promoting sexting. It’s the act that she is doing not so much the bare breast.

DJ_Critterus
06-06-2012, 4:34pm
I agree. Who should we ask first?

Since November, the 300-acre nature garden has displayed along one of it wooded walking paths 11 life-size bronze sculptures that were created and donated to the arboretum by Chinese sculptors.


Donations are fine as long as they aren't obscene. Any kind of "art" paid for with public funds needs to be voted on the by the people and not some small committee.

MrPeabody
06-06-2012, 4:56pm
Government involvement of any kind pollutes the very idea of art.

Fastguy
06-06-2012, 5:26pm
"I lak pitchers dat look lak stuff".

C5Nate
06-06-2012, 5:29pm
"I lak pitchers dat look lak stuff".



mrvette?

mrvette
06-06-2012, 5:32pm
It's art. Just because you dont "Get it" doesn't make it less valid.

Heathens. :D

BULL SHIT!!!!!!

ART is totally over rated, and so there are NO standards worth a shit....

and my old BIL was head of recorded sound at LOC that Library of CONNgress in Wash DC for years....finally made head of music division....about a month before he died....in '85....long story about that shit too....and it's NOT pretty the way liberals would like.....

I Know more than you, so don't get into a discussion with ME over that shit.....

:issues::issues::issues:

Burro (He/Haw)
06-06-2012, 5:34pm
I Know more than you, so don't get into a discussion with ME over that shit.....
http://www.thevettebarn.com/forums/681564-post12.html

mrvette
06-06-2012, 5:44pm
"I lak pitchers dat look lak stuff".

http://www.thevettebarn.com/forums/681564-post12.html

AS a matter of FACT I DOOOOOO, bring it to the table, and don't forget where I grew up/got older.....

what YOU know would fill a cig lighter, what I know would fill a bomb....


seriously....you have NO idea....:kick::sadangel:

Burro (He/Haw)
06-06-2012, 5:54pm
what YOU know would fill a cig lighter, what I know would fill a bomb....

Huh!?! WTF!!
http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m567bjx3YF1rx4ggio1_250.jpg

mrvette
06-06-2012, 6:02pm
Huh!?! WTF!!
http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m567bjx3YF1rx4ggio1_250.jpg

Want to discuss NEA/art/music.....

bring it to the table.....

otherwise shut the hell UP, .....and run away, children....

feel free to start another thread, and key it up from time to time so I can piss on your all's reality.....

I don't spend ALLLLLL day on here as you think, so I really looking forward to this fight.....it's going to be FUN!!!!!!!:issues::rofl::rofl:

OddBall
06-06-2012, 6:09pm
Art? No. Obscene? No? Inappropriate? Yes.
:iagree:
Have to agree. Although I would call it art. Probably just a little too intense though for a venue where kids can frequent.

Burro (He/Haw)
06-06-2012, 6:11pm
Want to discuss NEA/art/music.....

bring it to the table.....

otherwise shut the hell UP, .....and run away, children....

feel free to start another thread, and key it up from time to time so I can piss on your all's reality.....

I don't spend ALLLLLL day on here as you think, so I really looking forward to this fight.....it's going to be FUN!!!!!!!:issues::rofl::rofl:
Good lord.
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m56utxqD9S1qdlh1io1_400.gif

MrPeabody
06-06-2012, 6:15pm
Good lord.
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m56utxqD9S1qdlh1io1_400.gif

http://www.thevettebarn.com/forums/off-topic/35369-so-lets-discuss-nea-art-music.html :issues:

Blademaker
06-06-2012, 7:44pm
Art. Also, it was donated. Why the hell do people get all up in arms over this? Nudity and sex in this country are so fvcking demonized it's hilarious...but with the other hand EVERYTHING is violent and sex sells EVERYTHING.

We're such a fvcked up culture. :lol:

Nail/head

FasterTraffic
06-06-2012, 10:08pm
The reason some are upset is because they feel it is promoting sexting. It’s the act that she is doing not so much the bare breast.

Art is frequently subjective in its interpration but I see the sculpture as mocking sexting. The sculpture has no head, and therefore no identity and no mind, no persona. It's purely physical and fragmented. The compulsive attention-seeking that grows in parallel with our increasingly connected, social-media-driven world, is superficial and empty. There's no human connection between the sculpture/person and anyone who is a recipient of the photo. If anything, it weakens our human identity and drives some people to be dependent on the "likes" of a faceless, nameless, fickle mob.

C5Nate
06-06-2012, 10:12pm
Art is frequently subjective in its interpration but I see the sculpture as mocking sexting. The sculpture has no head, and therefore no identity and no mind, no persona. It's purely physical and fragmented. The compulsive attention-seeking that grows in parallel with our increasingly connected, social-media-driven world, is superficial and empty. There's no human connection between the sculpture/person and anyone who is a recipient of the photo. If anything, it weakens our human identity and drives some people to be dependent on the "likes" of a faceless, nameless, fickle mob.


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