Had a heart-warming criminal experience today

[lspencer534]

I had to go to my car today to retrieve a file. I saw 5 guys in the hotel parking garage next door, all with pistols drawn. One yelled at me to "Get back!", but another guy was pretty close to me, and I asked him what was going on.

He said that a man was breaking into a car parked on the first floor of the garage, they saw him, and they came from their printing shop across the street to nab him. The man saw them and ran toward the back door of the hotel where they lost sight of him. The hotel is closed, so if the man took the stairs down he was trapped in the delivery garage, and if he went up he was trapped because the stairwells are locked.

They had called the police who had not yet arrived. I asked the guy I was talking to if he knew how to use a pistol. He said, "I'm deadly at 40 feet." He had had training to get his CCW permit. All of these guys seemed to have a level head.

The police arrived and didn't find the man in the upper levels. They proceeded down the stairs to the delivery dock. The only place the man could hide there was behind a big stack of wooden crates. They told the man to come out with his hands up. No response. Then one policeman said, "If I have to come find you, when I see you I'm going to shoot you." The man came out, was placed in cuffs, and taken away.

I shook each man's hand, including the police. That's the kind of citizen involement we need! :hurray:

[BADRACR1]

Way to go, armed citizens!:seasix:

[Kerrmudgeon]

:rofl:....can you picture the face on the cops when they roll into the parking lot and see a bunch of guys with guns drawn! :willy:

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/-YRkrnd-Mrg/0.jpg

[Sea Six]

This one turned out ok, but to the average civilian, carrying a concealed weapon does NOT make you a cop. That gun is there to provide a pathway to safety for you and your loved ones.

It is NOT there for you to start enforcing the law. BTW, this situation could have gone terribly wrong in about 50 different ways. A number of them would not have worked out well for any of those turkeys packing a piece.

In most states, the laws dictating how deadly force can be used in a self defense situation are designed to protect you when you use deadly force properly in lawful self defense. Many of them are invalidated when you go off half-cocked and try to play Johnny Law, especially with little or no Law Enforcement training.

I don't know if any of these guys had any LE training, but this is the kind of stupid shit that even I, off-duty, as a current sworn LEO would likely not intervene except to be a great witness and to testify in court if needed. Why? Off-duty, I have no vest, no radio, no backup, dispatch doesn't know where I'm at, there's no place to lock up a suspect, etc. etc. etc.

[DAB]

Badges? We don't need no stinking badges!

[Sea Six]

Badges? We don't need no stinking badges!

Exactly. :seasix:

[78SA]

Did you give your card to the perp? :lol:

[Kerrmudgeon]

Badges? We don't need no stinking badges!

:rofl:.......welcome to the wild wild west. :stickemup:

[lspencer534]

:rofl:....can you picture the face on the cops when they roll into the parking lot and see a bunch of guys with guns drawn! :willy:

http://i.ytimg.com/vi/-YRkrnd-Mrg/0.jpg

The cops didn't act the least bit upset with the guys. I'm sure they appreciated their help.

[Kerrmudgeon]

The cops didn't act the least bit upset with the guys. I'm sure they appreciated their help.

Did he at least ask to see their carry permits? :toetap:

[lspencer534]

This one turned out ok, but to the average civilian, carrying a concealed weapon does NOT make you a cop. That gun is there to provide a pathway to safety for you and your loved ones.

It is NOT there for you to start enforcing the law. BTW, this situation could have gone terribly wrong in about 50 different ways. A number of them would not have worked out well for any of those turkeys packing a piece.

In most states, the laws dictating how deadly force can be used in a self defense situation are designed to protect you when you use deadly force properly in lawful self defense. Many of them are invalidated when you go off half-cocked and try to play Johnny Law, especially with little or no Law Enforcement training.

I don't know if any of these guys had any LE training, but this is the kind of stupid shit that even I, off-duty, as a current sworn LEO would likely not intervene except to be a great witness and to testify in court if needed. Why? Off-duty, I have no vest, no radio, no backup, dispatch doesn't know where I'm at, there's no place to lock up a suspect, etc. etc. etc.

I see your point, of course. If it had not worked out well, you'd see me condemning (maybe) what these guys did. However, it did work out well, and I appreciate those guys having the guts and sense of moral obligation to help with justice. Those "turkeys packing a piece" kept their cool. Except for their actions, the criminal would have successfully completed his robbery and be on his merry way to commit another crime.

In this case, at least, I applaud them. With all due respect for your views, of course.

[lspencer534]

Did he at least ask to see their carry permits? :toetap:

Nope. I think that would have been very bad PR for the police dept. to arrest citizens who definitley made an arrest possible. I would have liked to know what the criminal had in his mind when he saw that there were 5 men with guns after his ass and he was trappped. :rofl:

[JRD77VET]

I had to go to my car today to retrieve a file. I saw 5 guys in the hotel parking garage next door, all with pistols drawn. One yelled at me to "Get back!", but another guy was pretty close to me, and I asked him what was going on.

He said that a man was breaking into a car parked on the first floor of the garage, they saw him, and they came from their printing shop across the street to nab him. The man saw them and ran toward the back door of the hotel where they lost sight of him. The hotel is closed, so if the man took the stairs down he was trapped in the delivery garage, and if he went up he was trapped because the stairwells are locked.

They had called the police who had not yet arrived. I asked the guy I was talking to if he knew how to use a pistol. He said, "I'm deadly at 40 feet." He had had training to get his CCW permit. All of these guys seemed to have a level head.

The police arrived and didn't find the man in the upper levels. They proceeded down the stairs to the delivery dock. The only place the man could hide there was behind a big stack of wooden crates. They told the man to come out with his hands up. No response. Then one policeman said, "If I have to come find you, when I see you I'm going to shoot you." The man came out, was placed in cuffs, and taken away.

I shook each man's hand, including the police. That's the kind of citizen involement we need! :hurray:

This one turned out ok, but to the average civilian, carrying a concealed weapon does NOT make you a cop. That gun is there to provide a pathway to safety for you and your loved ones.

It is NOT there for you to start enforcing the law. BTW, this situation could have gone terribly wrong in about 50 different ways. A number of them would not have worked out well for any of those turkeys packing a piece.

In most states, the laws dictating how deadly force can be used in a self defense situation are designed to protect you when you use deadly force properly in lawful self defense. Many of them are invalidated when you go off half-cocked and try to play Johnny Law, especially with little or no Law Enforcement training.

I don't know if any of these guys had any LE training, but this is the kind of stupid shit that even I, off-duty, as a current sworn LEO would likely not intervene except to be a great witness and to testify in court if needed. Why? Off-duty, I have no vest, no radio, no backup, dispatch doesn't know where I'm at, there's no place to lock up a suspect, etc. etc. etc.

Reading what Larry wrote, it seems when the bad guy ran to and entered the stairs, they did NOT follow him. They waited for the police to arrive.

[OddBall]

Did you give your card to the perp? :lol:

:lol:

[lspencer534]

Reading what Larry wrote, it seems when the bad guy ran to and entered the stairs, they did NOT follow him. They waited for the police to arrive.

That is exactly correct. They stayed a distance away from the stairs (and the ramp leading upward since the didn't know which direction the criminal went) just to prevent him from escaping. Between the 5 of them they had all escape routes covered, even the 10' high chain link fence guarding the loading dock area.

They stayed in place, guns drawn and eyes open. They were not trying to find or start trouble. When the police arrived all except one (closest to the police) stayed in place to explain the situation to the police. All 5 guys were very cool and collected.

[lspencer534]

Did you give your card to the perp? :lol:

I hate to admit it, but I had the same thought: "A real lawyer would've tried to help the guy...." :dance:

[carlton_fritz]

I see your point, of course. If it had not worked out well, you'd see me condemning (maybe) what these guys did. However, it did work out well, and I appreciate those guys having the guts and sense of moral obligation to help with justice. Those "turkeys packing a piece" kept their cool. Except for their actions, the criminal would have successfully completed his robbery and be on his merry way to commit another crime.

In this case, at least, I applaud them. With all due respect for your views, of course.
:iagree: But we should stand aside like the Seinfeld gang and just watch.

[lspencer534]

:iagree: But we should stand aside like the Seinfeld gang and just watch.

:rofl: It just felt damned good to see a criminal get his stinking ass arrested on the spot. He may eventually go free, but at least his ass was caught and taken away. That happends are too rarely nowadays.

[78SA]

I hate to admit it, but I had the same thought: "A real lawyer would've tried to help the guy...." :dance:

:lol:

[Kerrmudgeon]

Nope. I think that would have been very bad PR for the police dept. to arrest citizens who definitley made an arrest possible. I would have liked to know what the criminal had in his mind when he saw that there were 5 men with guns after his ass and he was trappped. :rofl:

WTF!....they could have been a bunch of gang bangers with midnight specials and no permits!:slap:

"Hey guys, thanks for the help, but since you all are carrying, I'm going to have to see your permits. ".....no slight, and I'm sure they would not put up a fuss about it. :yesnod:

[lspencer534]

WTF!....they could have been a bunch of gang bangers with midnight specials and no permits!:slap:

"Hey guys, thanks for the help, but since you all are carrying, I'm going to have to see your permits. ".....no slight, and I'm sure they would not put up a fuss about it. :yesnod:

Well, I was there the entire timeand the police didn't ask. Oversight? Didn't care? I dunno. Perhaps they felt as I did, that the 5 guys were just concerned citizens trying to help...plus, no harm was done.

[BADRACR1]

We Dont Need No Stinkin Badges! - YouTube

[DJ_Critterus]

They Handled that well. :yesnod:

:thehandle:

[Allan]

* * *

The police arrived and didn't find the man in the upper levels. They proceeded down the stairs to the delivery dock. The only place the man could hide there was behind a big stack of wooden crates. They told the man to come out with his hands up. No response. Then one policeman said, "If I have to come find you, when I see you I'm going to shoot you." The man came out, was placed in cuffs, and taken away.

* * *

:hurray:

The clicking sound of an 870 loading one

or

"Come out or I'll send Thor in"

Either one of the above also works :yesnod:

[DJ_Critterus]

Man, I'm going to sleep happy tonight. The only thing better would be to watch a little porn before I take my shower and hit the rack (pun?)

[Fastguy]

This one turned out ok, but to the average civilian, carrying a concealed weapon does NOT make you a cop. That gun is there to provide a pathway to safety for you and your loved ones.

It is NOT there for you to start enforcing the law. BTW, this situation could have gone terribly wrong in about 50 different ways. A number of them would not have worked out well for any of those turkeys packing a piece.

In most states, the laws dictating how deadly force can be used in a self defense situation are designed to protect you when you use deadly force properly in lawful self defense. Many of them are invalidated when you go off half-cocked and try to play Johnny Law, especially with little or no Law Enforcement training.

I don't know if any of these guys had any LE training, but this is the kind of stupid shit that even I, off-duty, as a current sworn LEO would likely not intervene except to be a great witness and to testify in court if needed. Why? Off-duty, I have no vest, no radio, no backup, dispatch doesn't know where I'm at, there's no place to lock up a suspect, etc. etc. etc.

:iagree: with the mustachioed one.
What those guys did is about the dumbest thing I have ever read. You are going to shoot someone over someone else's property? These clowns would have spent tens of thousands in attorney fees if they killed that guy. Carrying for self defense is for self defense, not for playing posse and looking for trouble.

[Fastguy]

He said, "I'm deadly at 40 feet." He had had training to get his CCW permit.

Wait, I take back what I said, that above is the dumbest thing I have ever read. :rofl:

[DJ_Critterus]

:iagree: with the mustachioed one.
What those guys did is about the dumbest thing I have ever read. You are going to shoot someone over someone else's property? These clowns would have spent tens of thousands in attorney fees if they killed that guy. Carrying for self defense is for self defense, not for playing posse and looking for trouble.

I agree it was stupid too, but it's still heart warming.

[Fastguy]

I so hope they were all wearing this.

http://i474.photobucket.com/albums/rr101/mnponds/ccwbanner.jpg

[DJ_Critterus]

I so hope they were all wearing this.

http://i474.photobucket.com/albums/rr101/mnponds/ccwbanner.jpg

:funnier: That had to come from Kalifonia or Jersey, right?

[Sea Six]

:iagree: with the mustachioed one.
What those guys did is about the dumbest thing I have ever read. You are going to shoot someone over someone else's property? These clowns would have spent tens of thousands in attorney fees if they killed that guy. Carrying for self defense is for self defense, not for playing posse and looking for trouble.

Wait a second. Wait a second.









Will you please, just wait a second? :toetap:







I shaved off my 'stache several months ago. :yesnod:

[Sea Six]

Ok, here's one of the 50 ways this could have gone terribly wrong.


What if the guy was not committing a crime? Maybe the guys saw something and they thought a crime was being committed. They use deadly force (deadly force does not necessarily mean anyone dies, BTW) and it turns out no crime was ever committed.


Larry, you're a lawyer. Pretend you're a criminal defense atty. How many gallons of hot water do you think your five clients are now in?

Feel free to use any other units of measurement of hot water you feel are appropriate (including Olympic swimming pools, Gulfs of Mexico, etc).

Ga-head. Ga-head.


:bigears:

[Fastguy]

shaved off my 'stache several months ago. :yesnod:

WTF man, how do you expect to enforce teh law with no moustache?

[Sea Six]

WTF man, how do you expect to enforce teh law with no moustache?

I... I... I have already become an outcast in my own organization. :(

[DJ_Critterus]

WTF man, how do you expect to enforce teh law with no moustache?

I... I... I have already become an outcast in my own organization. :(

You will never be a post whore or moderator over at CF with no stache.. Come to think of it, the infamous mustache man over there looks like a molester so lets caall what he has a "molestache. "

[carlton_fritz]

:iagree: with the mustachioed one.
What those guys did is about the dumbest thing I have ever read. You are going to shoot someone over someone else's property? These clowns would have spent tens of thousands in attorney fees if they killed that guy. Carrying for self defense is for self defense, not for playing posse and looking for trouble.
This country needs more posses. :leaving:

[Sea Six]

Personally, I love going out and chasing posse.



:dance:

[Torqaholic]

... He said, "I'm deadly at 40 feet." He had had training to get his CCW permit. ...

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

OMG that's hilarious.

[Cybercowboy]

Did he at least ask to see their carry permits? :toetap:

Fortunately we don't live in a total police state, yet. Citizens don't have to "show their papers" at every LEO's whim. Not yet.

[DJ_Critterus]

Fortunately we don't live in a total police state, yet. Citizens don't have to "show their papers" at every LEO's whim. Not yet.

It's coming if we keep allowing libs to **** everything up for us.

[lspencer534]

Ok, here's one of the 50 ways this could have gone terribly wrong.


What if the guy was not committing a crime? Maybe the guys saw something and they thought a crime was being committed. They use deadly force (deadly force does not necessarily mean anyone dies, BTW) and it turns out no crime was ever committed.


Larry, you're a lawyer. Pretend you're a criminal defense atty. How many gallons of hot water do you think your five clients are now in?

Feel free to use any other units of measurement of hot water you feel are appropriate (including Olympic swimming pools, Gulfs of Mexico, etc).

Ga-head. Ga-head.


:bigears:

I see your point, and I know your point. I'm not advocating what these guys did, but it did turn out good. As far as calling them a "posse", that wasn't the case. They said that the man had a fanny pack around his waist (which he did), and the guys didn't know if he was armed or not. They had no intention of doing anything other than protect themselves until the police got there, and that's exactly what happened.

You're not going to tell me they didn't have the right to use deadly force if the man pulled a gun or charged at them, are you? As far as whether this man was committing a crime, he had every opportunity to show the police his ownership or right to try to break into the car.

If the guys had tried to capture the man, then they could have been in trouble, physically and legally. As it was, I see no legal problem with what they did.

[Cybercowboy]

It's coming if we keep allowing libs to **** everything up for us.

They're just doing it for the lil' chilrun.

[Cybercowboy]

I see your point, and I know your point. I'm not advocating what these guys did, but it did turn out good. As far as calling them a "posse", that wasn't the case. They said that the man had a fanny pack around his waist (which he did), and the guys didn't know if he was armed or not. They had no intention of doing anything other than protect themselves until the police got there, and that's exactly what happened.

You're not going to tell me they didn't have the right to use deadly force if the man pulled a gun or charged at them, are you? As far as whether this man was committing a crime, he had every opportunity to show the police his ownership or right to try to break into the car.

If the guys had tried to capture the man, then they could have been in trouble, physically and legally. As it was, I see no legal problem with what they did.

Me neither, but then I live in an area of the country that criminals know that it's best to assume your victim is armed, and that breaking into a home means if you encounter the resident, it's likely said resident it pointing a nice big gun at your chest.

[DJ_Critterus]

Me neither, but then I live in an area of the country that criminals know that it's best to assume your victim is armed, and that breaking into a home means if you encounter the resident, it's likely said resident it pointing a nice big gun at your chest.

Sounds like my 'hood. :yesnod:

[lspencer534]

Me neither, but then I live in an area of the country that criminals know that it's best to assume your victim is armed, and that breaking into a home means if you encounter the resident, it's likely said resident it pointing a nice big gun at your chest.

That's almost as it should be. Ideally, the house burglar wouldn't be breaking into your home in the first place, but maybe enough homeowners can eventually eliminate that problem.

[Cybercowboy]

That's almost as it should be. Ideally, the house burglar wouldn't be breaking into your home in the first place, but maybe enough homeowners can eventually eliminate that problem.

You probably know that the city I live in, Joplin MO, got hit by a largish tornado last year. The only major looting issues we had came not from roaming bands of outlaw looters, but various relief workers themselves. For instance, three firefighters from a nearby town, including the fire chief, were busted for stealing generators, chain saws, lawn mowers, and other items from homes they were "guarding". Some National Guard members were busted for, again, taking valuables from homes they were guarding. At least one city cop was busted for stealing bottles of booze from a destroyed liquor store.

The relief workers who finally cleared my mother's garage roof that pancaked down on the contents stole her lawn mower and generator. We already had a guy signed up to clear the debris but these relief workers took it upon themselves to clear that garage roof for us, bless their hearts. :rolleyes:

Actually, two days after the tornado I watched a group of people going through the remains of a liquor store's beer section while a couple of cops were parked not 50 feet away. As we pulled near the cops, I said "What's up with that?" They said "Eh, it's just going to go bad out in the sun, they can have at it." What was comical was that these people all had plastic bags that were blowing around everywhere and you could see what they had in them. Each person was picking through for their favorite brand. :lol:

There were countless homes with "You loot we shoot" spray painted on the siding. And believe me, they meant it.

[mrvette]

"You loot we shoot" spray painted on the siding. And believe me, they meant it.




Damn straight, in a microsecond and not even any remorse....NONE what so ever....

:kimblair:

[Allan]

Personally, I love going out and chasing posse.



:dance:

:rofl:

[Jeff '79]

Thanks for sharing that story Spence.
Corner the animal, and wait for po-po...
He was prolly glad the cops showed up, after 5 guys announced they were armed and waiting for him to reappear.
I'll put that one in the memory bank for later use.
The guys did their civic duty, and didn't have to go through the bs paper work, money expenditure, and mental scars, that a shooting will inevitably cause.
They handled the situation perfectly....:seasix:

[lspencer534]

Thanks for sharing that story Spence.
Corner the animal, and wait for po-po...
He was prolly glad the cops showed up, after 5 guys announced they were armed and waiting for him to reappear.
I'll put that one in the memory bank for later use.
The guys did their civic duty, and didn't have to go through the bs paper work, money expenditure, and mental scars, that a shooting will inevitably cause.
They handled the situation perfectly....:seasix:

I think they handled it perfectly, too. There have been some naysayers in this thread, and I agree that things could have gone wrong. But nothing went wrong, likely because of what you just said: 5 guys with guns waiting to see if the crook was stupid enough to reappear. It'd take a pretty stupid crook to take them all on.

[Jeff '79]

I think they handled it perfectly, too. There have been some naysayers in this thread, and I agree that things could have gone wrong. But nothing went wrong, likely because of what you just said: 5 guys with guns waiting to see if the crook was stupid enough to reappear. It'd take a pretty stupid crook to take them all on.

Not only that, but five guys word against one, goes a long way in court.
If, however it was just one guy, and that guy was me, I would have walked. No one to back me up, or my story up ? See ya !

[lspencer534]

Not only that, but five guys word against one, goes a long way in court.
If, however it was just one guy, and that guy was me, I would have walked. No one to back me up, or my story up ? See ya !

The reason all 5 guys saw the crook was that they were unloading a delivery truck at the curb. They heard a loud noise and saw the crook trying to break into a car. All of them said they always keep their pistol in their pocket in case someone tries to rob their print shop.

I agree--if it had been just me, I would've called the cops and waited in my office.

[Jeff '79]

The reason all 5 guys saw the crook was that they were unloading a delivery truck at the curb. They heard a loud noise and saw the crook trying to break into a car. All of them said they always keep their pistol in their pocket in case someone tries to rob their print shop.

I agree--if it had been just me, I would've called the cops and waited in my office.

That dude was definitely in the wrong place at the wrong time...:rofl:

[lspencer534]

That dude was definitely in the wrong place at the wrong time...:rofl:

Apparently the lesson is, never overestimate the intelligence of a crook. :lol:

[kingpin]

I would of killed him with kindness.
Peace, love and harmony peeps.
If we all understand that there will be no need for guns and war.
Peace-out!

[lspencer534]

I would of killed him with kindness.
Peace, love and harmony peeps.
If we all understand that there will be no need for guns and war.
Peace-out!

Awww.....how sweet! :D

[Jeff '79]

I would of killed him with kindness.
Peace, love and harmony peeps.
If we all understand that there will be no need for guns and war.
Peace-out!

Like how ???

Come out and I'll blow you ??....:rofl:

[lspencer534]

Like how ???

Come out and I'll blow you ??....:rofl:

Somehow I prefer, "Come out and I'll blow you away...."

[island14]

Did you give your card to the perp? :lol:


:lol: