College Thread Got Me Wondering

[Burro (He/Haw)]

Who went and feel it was a waste considering their current employment situation;

Who did not attend college and wish they would have or feel it has held them back in their job.

Discuss.

[Hoog]

I would not have been considered for my current job without a degree, but my degree has really nothing to do with my job.

[repo]

I would not have been considered for my current job without a degree, but my degree has really nothing to do with my job.

:withstupid:

No degree, no interview.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

I would not have been considered for my current job without a degree, but my degree has really nothing to do with my job.

So your degree was necessary to procure your current position. Therefore you are in the "College was worth it" camp.

[Jeff '79]

I would not have been considered for my current job without a degree, but my degree has really nothing to do with my job.

:iagree: Same here....:yesnod:

[VatorMan]

I make more than the degree'd engineers at my site. I keep their asses out of trouble. Most of them have no f'n clue how things actually work.

[Hoog]

So your degree was necessary to procure your current position. Therefore you are in the "College was worth it" camp.
Yup. While the actual class work isn't applicable, the ancillary skills I honed while getting the degree have been invaluable.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

I make more than the degree'd engineers at my site. I keep their asses out of trouble. Most of them have no f'n clue how things actually work.

Terrific. This doesn't answer my question however.

[lspencer534]

Definitely worth it. Since I'm a lawyer, and that requires an undergrad degree to get into law school, and you have to have a law degree to take the bar exam, passing the bar exam is the only way to get a license to practice law. BTW, even though I have a J.D. (Juris Doctorate), you don't have to call me Doctor. :rofl:

[kingpin]

I dropped out of high school at 17 years old and had 3 jobs to boot.
Making money hand over fist.
I learned a hell of a lot being in business for myself for years. Things that school would never of taught me.

But, I always tell the younger people I meet to go to college or University because I think it helps to fullfill one's life. The experience of going to College should be available to everyone at any age.

School will not teach you instinct, negotiations(real life) and how business works in the real world. It teaches you how things are supposed to work and hopefully gives you some structure to take with you when you are out.

[The_Dude]

My degree is directly applicable to my current job. Without it, I'd still be running a chainsaw for a living.

[kingpin]

*have

thanks snide. i left the capitals off hoping it bothers you. :D

[Jeff '79]

So your degree was necessary to procure your current position. Therefore you are in the "College was worth it" camp.

You must have missed that day in class if you can't answerer that for yourself.....
That being said, a guy in high school, who was a successful drug dealer at the time, inherited $15m from his father, and he is parlaying it into major building projects around the area....I think that he barely passed HS, and certainly didn't go to college....Money does buy really smart people though, but he is a really street smart business man too...College absolutely helps...But he didn't need it , and he's richer than all of us combined.

[beadist]

A degree was required for my job and I use the knowledge from school every day.

[Blademaker]

I went to the college of hard knocks. :D

No college, no degree, all I could do to fight my way oughtta high school.
I went straight to work right outta the 12th grade, at my Dads scrap metal business. Years later, My brother and I bought the business & ran it better than our Dad. Sold it and retired relatively young.
I did well with no degree, but there are days when I can't help but think "What if ?"
I took a business administration course at a community college for one semester when I was about 27-28. Rarely cracked a book, was bored as hell, and my score was 3rd highest in the class. Would have been 2nd had I not argued a point about business with the teacher.
But I've made damn sure that my 2 sons and wife have had some college experience.
My wife went back to school at age 38, worked part time, and graduated with a degree in education when she was 45.
She's my hero.:)

[NB2K]

I went to the college of hard knocks. :D

No college, no degree, all I could do to fight my way oughtta high school.
I went straight to work right outta the 12th grade, at my Dads scrap metal business. Years later, My brother and I bought the business & ran it better than our Dad. Sold it and retired relatively young.
I did well with no degree, but there are days when I can't help but think "What if ?"
I took a business administration course at a community college for one semester when I was about 27-28. Rarely cracked a book, was bored as hell, and my score was 3rd highest in the class. Would have been 2nd had I not argued a point about business with the teacher.
But I've made damn sure that my 2 sons and wife have had some college experience.
My wife went back to school at age 38, worked part time, and graduated with a degree in education when she was 45.
She's my hero.:)

This post is excellent on many levels.

[SubZero]

:withstupid:

No degree, no interview.
I've got an associates degree and 10+ years in my field with a relatively diverse skillset and can't even get a a face to face interview for any jobs requiring a bachelors degree despite my experience. :rolleyes: Problem is that it will take me another 6-8 years to finish my bachelors since the univeristy has cut most of the evening classes because of budget cuts (yet tuition is still increasing 4-5% each year) I'd switch schools but can't afford anything beyond the state university :leaving:

[Entropy]

I have to have the degree to do what I do now, and college was valuable to me.

However, I sacrificed a lot of time and I'm just now starting to reap my rewards.

[RedLS1GTO]

As others have said, without the degree, I have no chance at being considered for the job I have now.

I had multiple job offers in one of the worst economies this country has ever seen because I have the words Purdue Engineering and U.S. Navy Officer on my resume.

While I haven't found the need to solve a differential equation at my current job, I do feel that the basic theories and mentality that I learned are very relevant. There are many things that I come across that would be nearly impossible with the education I had out of high school.

[PortDawg]

I earned an Associates Degree in Transportation while on Active Duty. I've been screwing around for years since then. For the past year, I've been finishing up my Bachelors Degree in Computer Science/Information Assurance and Security. 2 more semesters and I'm done. 4 more classes.

My job in Models and Simulations works so well since I have the technical knowledge of a the Computer Science degree and the Logistics experience of the AAS and 22+ years of experience.

Is it worth it? We'll see, I'm kinda stuck where I am without it.

[PortDawg]

I've got an associates degree and 10+ years in my field with a relatively diverse skillset and can't even get a a face to face interview for any jobs requiring a bachelors degree despite my experience. :rolleyes: Problem is that it will take me another 6-8 years to finish my bachelors since the univeristy has cut most of the evening classes because of budget cuts (yet tuition is still increasing 4-5% each year) I'd switch schools but can't afford anything beyond the state university :leaving:

Online?

[mrvette]

Age 68 here with 3 years college almost 40 years ago, I studied business, not that it gave me a damn piece of information to actually make money, hell a book keeping course in HS would have done that....

The ONLY college worth going for is HARD science, engineering, finance, econ, maybe some management....

Offhand I can't think of one other field that pays shit to make a degree in it worthwhile.....

All the welfare/liberal arts degrees are without any redeeming value except to some .gov welfare agency....that is defined as employing useless professors to teach things like english, philosophy, phychology, sociology (WTF IS THAT ANYWAY), ART, and of course underwater basketweaving.....

AND SO, an expanding population supplies these useless 'professors' with new clients, so they can teach useless crap to kids, wasting their time and effort and MONEY/DEBT, to fund another stupid building on some campus so some politician can name it after himself/who/what/EVER to appear sanctimonious and get his pix taken in front of some insipid crowd.....

THERE, did I kick enough ass for NOW??? :kick::kick::kick::beat::rofl::leaving:

[MEC5LADY]

No degree no job but I sometimes wonder if some of my coworkers in the hospital bought their degree from a gumball machine.

[mrvette]

No degree no job but I sometimes wonder if some of my coworkers in the hospital bought their degree from a gumball machine.

OH do you EVER got that straight, :lol::lol:

[Rapid Roger]

I went to night school for nine years to get an ME......I was working at the time although I never held an engineering job.......But......When I completed my MBA I got a huge jump in pay and the door opened for advancement.......:)

[DAB]

Degree, but no job now.

Managed to pick two industries that have imploded. Nuclear power plants and commercial real estate. Oops.

Woodworking is a break even hobby. :DAB:

[Datawiz]

My degree has never gotten me a job, however, the knowledge I gained at college is used in my career considerably.

Degree is in accounting, career is in software development, but I develop a ton of accounting business systems. :yesnod:

[JRC27]

I think having a degree helped me get my first job, but i didn't use it. I think it was more of who my next door neighbor was, lol. My degree is in Physics and i started as a Nuclear security guard. Did that for a year and a half and then bid in to the Chemistry dept. I ended up using my degree there for 7 years. Now i'm in training to be a reactor operator.... :leaving:

[JRC27]

Nuclear power plants

Not quite sure how they have imploded :rofl:

[Burro (He/Haw)]

Managed to pick two industries that have imploded. Nuclear power plants
On what planet did this happen? Not this one

[SnikPlosskin]

My first degree is Bachelor of Fine Arts - Graphic Design. Almost worthless unless I want to make about $35K a year slaving in a cubicle. But I've added a degree in Marketing which bumps me up to about $40K a year slaving in a cubicle.

But the fact is, it was the act of going to school, dealing with the school, and all the experiences around it that turned out to be valuable and make it worthwhile.

But my real "education" has been by starting and running my own businesses. I have spent zero time in a cubicle. And those marketing and graphic design folks work for me. :dance:

[SubZero]

Online?

Not unless I would switch majors.

[themonk]

There's not a classroom on this planet that can teach you as much as on the job training can.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

There's not a classroom on this planet that can teach you as much as on the job training can.

Perhaps, but you gotta GET to the job. :cert:

[themonk]

Perhaps, but you gotta GET to the job. :cert:

Start in the mail room after you graduate from high school.

Seriously, name me one job that you can't do if you had on the job training without any formal education.

[Jeff '79]

Not only does college teach you things from books, but it measures you, to see if you have the wherewithal to endure to the end, (graduate).
It really is a microcosm of the real world, albeit protected, and teaches you how to maneuver through the BS of life. Not only is the study aspect a pita, but the registering, as well as all of the other ancillary BS that goes along with attending college. It's a wake up call, and teaches you the dog eat dog mentality. Either you adapt, and thrive, or you get thrown back into the sea of fishes. .....

[JRC27]

Start in the mail room after you graduate from high school.

Seriously, name me one job that you can't do if you had on the job training without any formal education.

Practice any sort of medicine, Operate a nuclear reactor, etc...

[Jeff '79]

Start in the mail room after you graduate from high school.

Seriously, name me one job that you can't do if you had on the job training without any formal education.

Engineer, doctor, accountant, physicist, rocket scientist........Want me to go on ?

[cmb396]

I would not have landed my first two jobs in sales and marketing w/o my degree. However, I am now a personal trainer at a gym, and flipping houses. So, my BA in marketing/management is somewhat useless at this point.
Had I had it to do over, I would have done something medical related. Most likely a physical therapist.
I'm only 33 tho, so going back to school is an option, a nauseating one, but still out there.

[themonk]

Practice any sort of medicine, Operate a nuclear reactor, etc...

Engineer, doctor, accountant, physicist, rocket scientist........Want me to go on ?

So you're telling me that a kid fresh out of high school with a reasonable degree of intelligence can't learn those jobs with 10 years of on the job training.......

Accountant Jeff, c'mon, you might as well of said grocery store clerk.

If you shadowed someone in any of those fields you'd learn much more than anything a "professor" could teach you.

Think about this, a kid fresh out of med school does not got straight into the operating room, he gets hands on experience before he goes near a scalpel and that's after 8 years of schooling so don't you think that he'd pick up a thing or two being along side a doctor for 8 years.

[Jeff '79]

So you're telling me that a kid fresh out of high school with a reasonable degree of intelligence can't learn those jobs with 10 years of on the job training.......

Accountant Jeff, c'mon, you might as well of said grocery store clerk.

If you shadowed someone in any of those fields you'd learn much more than anything a "professor" could teach you.

Think about this, a kid fresh out of med school does not got straight into the operating room, he gets hands on experience before he goes near a scalpel and that's after 8 years of schooling so don't you think that he'd pick up a thing or two being along side a doctor for 8 years.

You obviously have no idea what is involved with accounting, for a bank or large company....Employers don't want to wait for 10 years for someone to learn their craft, especially on their dime.. You walk in their door, and you better be able to perform with the quickness, or you're out the door....10 years....:rofl:

[polarbear]

Start in the mail room after you graduate from high school.

Seriously, name me one job that you can't do if you had on the job training without any formal education.
The realistic question isn't whether you can do the job, but whether you can get the job.

[FasterTraffic]

I have a "useless" degree that makes me valuable anywhere but I don't work in that field.



English, mother f**ker, do you speak it?

[themonk]

The realistic question isn't whether you can do the job, but whether you can get the job.

And that's exactly it.

[ft laud mike]

My degrees are meaningless jobwise, except I get a little bit $$ extra for having them. After going through the trouble /expense I realized unless I was
-somebodys (boss/ higher up) friend
-Good looking female
-kiss azz
-EEO (doesn't apply, I'm a white male)
-good at interoffice politics (not me)
I was going to have to wait a loooong time to get promoted, only took 15 years, with a MPA, when The Director of my Dept(5 paygrades ahead of me) has a HS diploma
YMMV
:cert:

[themonk]

You obviously have no idea what is involved with accounting, for a bank or large company....Employers don't want to wait for 10 years for someone to learn their craft, especially on their dime.. You walk in their door, and you better be able to perform with the quickness, or you're out the door....10 years....:rofl:

If Albert Einstein can be self taught I'm pretty sure that someone who wants to be an accountant can learn from someone on the job.

What can a teacher teach you that a professional account can't, please answer me that one question, I'll be waiting here for the next 10 minutes.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

Now i'm in training to be a reactor operator....
What site? SRO's are well paid.

[LATB]

Start in the mail room after you graduate from high school.

Seriously, name me one job that you can't do if you had on the job training without any formal education.

I've been a carpenter my whole life...40+ years at it. Designed & build homes...And I'll never be an architect without the paper.

[Jeff '79]

If Albert Einstein can be self taught I'm pretty sure that someone who wants to be an accountant can learn from someone on the job.

What can a teacher teach you that a professional account can't, please answer me that one question, I'll be waiting here for the next 10 minutes.

Oh, so an accounting firm is going to teach a prospective employee, how to account ? On their dime ?....10 minutes is up... Go away...Your rational is inane.

[themonk]

I've been a carpenter my whole life...40+ years at it. Designed & build homes...And I'll never be an architect without the paper.

But you know just as much, that's my point. Hands on learning is just as good as schooling however employers are looking for a piece of paper saying you know something. I bet that there are backyard mechanics out there who know a hell of a lot more about fixing cars than certified mechanics but can't work at a franchise dealership because they don't have formal training.

[kingpin]

All as I know is you can't frame pictures without a diploma. :D

[LATB]

All as I know is you can't frame pictures without a diploma. :D

does one need a diploma to frame a diploma? :lol:

[repo]

If Albert Einstein can be self taught I'm pretty sure that someone who wants to be an accountant can learn from someone on the job.

What can a teacher teach you that a professional account can't, please answer me that one question, I'll be waiting here for the next 10 minutes.

The point is why wait or go thru the hassle of training someone on the job when a lot of that training can be brought in?

No one wants to babysit someone while they learn all day every day.Takes the productivity away from the person who is doing the training.

[Entropy]

If Albert Einstein can be self taught I'm pretty sure that someone who wants to be an accountant can learn from someone on the job.

What can a teacher teach you that a professional account can't, please answer me that one question, I'll be waiting here for the next 10 minutes.
Except he wasn't self taught, he went to one of the most prestigious universities in Europe. He just couldn't get a position right away after school.

[Skia]

My associates in Industrial management degree has done me no good at all in 12 years.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

My associates in Industrial management degree has done me no good at all in 12 years.

Maybe you need a haircut or some "Just for Men?" You know, look a little younger, more hip? :leaving:

[Jeff '79]

Maybe you need a haircut or some "Just for Men?" You know, look a little younger, more hip? :leaving:

:rofl::rofl: Skia's takin' a beating tonight....2 Hondas though today...Can't argue with that..They were prolly pity sales though....:rofl:

[bryanZ06]

I went to college (didn't graduate) with the idea I'd do something in marketing. I moved back home in 02 and became a firefighter a couple of years later. My time in college (while fun) was an absolute waste for me.

[ConstantChange]

My degree is directly applicable to my current job.

This. My current job requires a bachelors degree from a small list of majors to even get an interview. I use the skills I learned in about 2-3 classes on a regular basis.

Without the degree, I'd have to work a lot harder to make the kind of money I do.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

Two delusions fostered by higher education are that what is taught corresponds to what is learned, and that will somehow pay off in more money.

[repo]

Two delusions fostered by higher education are that what is taught corresponds to what is learned, and that will somehow pay off in more money.
True, but it is proven higher education yields more money over a life time.
To be continued....

[mrvette]

You obviously have no idea what is involved with accounting, for a bank or large company....Employers don't want to wait for 10 years for someone to learn their craft, especially on their dime.. You walk in their door, and you better be able to perform with the quickness, or you're out the door....10 years....:rofl:

Like my buddy's daughters....corporate CPA's married similar husbands, grossing about a meg a year per family one in Columbus or Cincinn....the other in Dallas....had a chance to talk to one of them a few years ago, and that kid is sharp as a tack, way beyond smart....but she had NO choice, either that or her mother would have terminated her long since....:kick::lol:

[Iron Chef]

I've always done very well in aircraft design without a degree. I guess I had a talent for it. However, I went back to school for a few reasons:

1) This is a personal goal. I want to prove to myself that I can accomplish this.

2) I promised my parents...both now deceased...that I would finish. It was important to them and it's one way I honor their memory.

3) Going to college and getting a degree is the only thing that I absolutely require of my children. I don't think it's fair that I ask someone to do anything that I'm not willing to do myself, so it's to school I go.

I already have my A.A. and I finish my Bachelors (after nearly 15 years) in December.

[Frizzle]

Went to college on a sports scholarship to get a Graphic Design and Marketing degree.

Got in a cubicle and got tired of making 30-40K a year. Went back to school to get a MBA.. for one year. Realized that I wanted to do something different.

Currently i am an industrial/commercial electrician. (no need for a degree). Eventually hoping to get some scratch saved up and move forward starting up a business.

If I could do it all over again, I would probably gone to college to get a degree in biology and then to a doctorate program in Physical Therapy.

[JRC27]

What site? SRO's are well paid.

I'm Still at Fitzpatrick, but not going SRO, just union RO

[JRC27]

So you're telling me that a kid fresh out of high school with a reasonable degree of intelligence can't learn those jobs with 10 years of on the job training.......



Yes that's what i'm saying.

Who hands out 10 years of on the job training? It used to take 4 years to become a non-licensed nuclear plant operator, now they want you done in 18 months. It used to take 18 months + to complete an NRC nuclear reactor operator training program, now they want our class to do it in 12.

[Jeff '79]

Yes that's what i'm saying.

Who hands out 10 years of on the job training? It used to take 4 years to become a non-licensed nuclear plant operator, now they want you done in 18 months. It used to take 18 months + to complete an NRC nuclear reactor operator training program, now they want our class to do it in 12.

:yesnod: And that is pretty much true for any professional position....Monk must've been smoking crack last night.....Very uncharacteristic of him to have a lapse of reality, like that.

[kingpin]

:yesnod: And that is pretty much true for any professional position....Monk must've been smoking crack last night.....Very uncharacteristic of him to have a lapse of reality, like that.

Yeah, I was laughing at what he was saying waiting for him to 'fess up.

I always thought a good way of doing things in high school was; if you know what you want to do you get placement right away and start working in the field along with schooling of course.
If you plan on working for someone else your whole life you need a couple of important things:
1. contacts
2. experience

[Burro (He/Haw)]

I always thought a good way of doing things in high school was
Dropping out?

[kingpin]

Dropping out?

???

[LATB]

Yes that's what i'm saying.

Who hands out 10 years of on the job training? It used to take 4 years to become a non-licensed nuclear plant operator, now they want you done in 18 months. It used to take 18 months + to complete an NRC nuclear reactor operator training program, now they want our class to do it in 12.

carpenters
cabinet makers
plumbers
electricians
painters
masons
glaziers
concrete finishers.............................

[repo]

carpenters
cabinet makers
plumbers
electricians
painters
masons
glaziers
concrete finishers.............................

If it takes 10 years to become one of them I dont wnat them working on my house.

painters= drunks

[Iron Chef]

Try being a test pilot for the Air Force. It's not like you can just go to your local base and fill out an application.

[NB2K]

We can debate this until the cows come home and it won't change the simple fact that, in an overwhelming majority of the cases, college graduates (undergrad and advanced) make significantly more than do non-degreed workers.

I do not have a degree, but many of those who work for me do have a 4-year degree.

One would have to be a fool to enter today's workforce w/o at least a 4 year degree.

Exceptions always apply, but that's what they are-exceptions.

That piece of paper tells your prospective employer that you have the ability to learn.

[Iron Chef]

We can debate this until the cows come home and it won't change the simple fact that, in an overwhelming majority of the cases, college graduates (undergrad and advanced) make significantly more than do non-degreed workers.

I do not have a degree, but many of those who work for me do have a 4-year degree.

One would have to be a fool to enter today's workforce w/o at least a 4 year degree.

Exceptions always apply, but that's what they are-exceptions.

That piece of paper tells your prospective employer that you have the ability to learn.

This.

AND that you have the ability to take a major project and see it through to its completion.

My children both know it's absolutely essential for them to get their degrees if they are to be successful. In fact, my son, who is a junior in HS is already talking about "when I go for my Masters."

[repo]

That piece of paper tells your prospective employer that you have the ability to learn.

and basically follow rules also.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

carpenters
cabinet makers
plumbers
electricians
painters
masons
glaziers
concrete finishers.............................
All the MN State Building Trades have an apprenticeship program. If you think they are going to take a 10 year journeyman that doesn't know how to build cabinets, install fixtures in a bathroom, paint a wall, make welds in a refinery or nuclear facility, you have much to learn.

That piece of paper tells your prospective employer that you have the ability to learn.

Bullshit. Again; Two delusions fostered by higher education are that what is taught corresponds to what is learned, and that will somehow pay off in more money.

[LATB]

If it takes 10 years to become one of them I dont wnat them working on my house.

painters= drunks

it only takes a few years as an apprentice for most tradesmen to "get it"...

however a good tradesmen is always improving his skills.

and professional painters are not drunks.

[repo]

it only takes a few years as an apprentice for most tradesmen to "get it"...

however a good tradesmen is always improving his skills.

and professional painters are not drunks.

You mentioned 10 years not me.

painters and roofers around here are drunks.

[mrvette]

I've always done very well in aircraft design without a degree. I guess I had a talent for it. However, I went back to school for a few reasons:

1) This is a personal goal. I want to prove to myself that I can accomplish this.

2) I promised my parents...both now deceased...that I would finish. It was important to them and it's one way I honor their memory.

3) Going to college and getting a degree is the only thing that I absolutely require of my children. I don't think it's fair that I ask someone to do anything that I'm not willing to do myself, so it's to school I go.

I already have my A.A. and I finish my Bachelors (after nearly 15 years) in December.

Isn't that interesting, how paths cross even decades later....my father was a design worker on experimental aircraft for Martin Marietta in Cleveland Ohio, back in the 20's I have some of his tools in the box he used on site....
he worked on wings crafting prototypes they wanted to try out...so he would cut/bend/rivet the metal....he never mentioned welding to me, so doubt that TIG was invented yet....

been a while....

:cert:

[Burro (He/Haw)]

however a good tradesmen is always improving his skills.

Case in point, welding. I spend years welding carbon steel and stainless steel. Stick, TIG, Wirefeed whatever.

Then I got on a job at Union Carbide where they were welding Hastelloy. My employer paid for me to spend 8 hours in a welding booth learning how to run this filler rod that welds the pipe.

By the end of the day, they shot my coupon, and I passed. I had 15 years in my trade when this happened.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

How does that invalidate the fact that getting a degree shows that you can commit to something and learn at least reasonably well?
How many college grads you know are morons?

[LATB]

You mentioned 10 years not me.

I responded to this:

Yes that's what i'm saying.

Who hands out 10 years of on the job training? It used to take 4 years to become a non-licensed nuclear plant operator, now they want you done in 18 months. It used to take 18 months + to complete an NRC nuclear reactor operator training program, now they want our class to do it in 12.

my point was...contractors and tradesmen "hand out" on the job training, meaning it's not a paid for education.

if I misunderstood the "hand out" part, my error.


painters and roofers around here are drunks.

and I bet there are auto mechanics...teachers...LEO's...repo men...etc that are as well. but I bet there are also professionals that are not.

the "painters are drunks" cliche' is tired. IMO.

btw, the roofers who just did my new roof were a couple rough looking dudes, who probably have a bud light or 6 after work...hell, they may even smoke a fatty on the way home...

but, those two men did the best job of installing a shingle roof I have ever had.

and, the man who painted the last 4 or 5 homes for me is top notch, and very professional.

there are still quality tradesmen out there, you have to find them...and you have to pay the price.

:cert:

[LATB]

How many college grads you know are morons?

Obama :D


sorry man, couldn't resist. :lol:

[Burro (He/Haw)]

my point was...contractors and tradesmen "hand out" on the job training, meaning it's not a paid for education.
Every apprenticeship program in this state costs the applicant money. For the Steamfitters, (My trade) there is 1 year of full time day school, (On your dime) and 5 years of night school. (Your dime also)

[DAB]

having designed and made a few things in my shop for others, and having investigated the local tax and business climate/situation, i can assure you that i could not charge enough to make a profit in my shop on paper.

people have gotten too used to mass produced items, made out of the cheapest materials possible. if i accounted for the power and tool depreciation and other consumables (like sand paper), i'd show a loss for everything i made. and if i tried to charge more, i'd have no sales.

thankfully, i can run my shop as a break even hobby (at best), and can afford to give away some projects for free or just the cost of the lumber.

[JRC27]

my point was...contractors and tradesmen "hand out" on the job training, meaning it's not a paid for education.

if I misunderstood the "hand out" part, my error.


My point was that there aren't any professions that i know of that are going to give you 10 years to become proficient.

[LATB]

My point was that there aren't any professions that i know of that are going to give you 10 years to become proficient.

I would agree.

[LATB]

Every apprenticeship program in this state costs the applicant money. For the Steamfitters, (My trade) there is 1 year of full time day school, (On your dime) and 5 years of night school. (Your dime also)

those are probably union shops.

most residential construction is non union trades. most guys in home building/remodeling start as a helper and learn the trade or trades...the cost is ZERO to the greenhorn...and he earns a buck while learning.

:cert:

[Burro (He/Haw)]

those are probably union shops
They are.

[mrvette]

How many college grads you know are morons?

Try ever lawyer in DC......

seriously.....

:seasix::lol:

[LATB]

How many college grads you know are morons?

have you peeped the "occupy" crowd? :lol:

[Burro (He/Haw)]

have you peeped the "occupy" crowd? :lol:
Are those idiots STILL at it?

[LATB]

Are those idiots STILL at it?

yes

In DC they have cost the taxpayers 6 million in additional police force...millions in clean-up and sanitation...there are rats...drugs...violence...trash/health/sanitation problems...

these morons are camping...many have been there for 6 months...and it took a congressional hearing grilling the Park Service liberal idiot to finally enforce the law and begin to remove the campers. yes, there is some "interpretation" of the law being debated...however, the Parkdouche has taken a liberal position and sided w/ the camper....err, I mean protesters.

at the expense of the community and local businesses.


btw...you don't know this?

[polarbear]

I see both sides of this argument. In our own circle of close friends, the majority are what I would describe as "rich rednecks." Generally folks that started their own business, did well, and did so without the benefit of a college degree. Interestingly enough, all of them, without exception, are paying (or already paid) the big bucks to send their kids through college. Not one exception I can think of.

Here's the other side of the coin. My BIL is a senior exec with Microsoft. I don't even want to speculate on his income (but I've got a pretty good idea- high six-low seven figures). He worked in the paper mill to put himself through Oregon State (Engineering Degree), then let Tektronix pay for his MBA. Without that piece of paper, he'd still be working in the paper mill. :yesnod:

[themonk]

Don't Need a College Degree -- College is Overrated (http://learnfinancialplanning.com/why-you-dont-need-a-college-degree/)

[NB2K]

I see both sides of this argument. In our own circle of close friends, the majority are what I would describe as "rich rednecks." Generally folks that started their own business, did well, and did so without the benefit of a college degree. Interestingly enough, all of them, without exception, are paying (or already paid) the big bucks to send their kids through college. Not one exception I can think of.

Here's the other side of the coin. My BIL is a senior exec with Microsoft. I don't even want to speculate on his income (but I've got a pretty good idea- high six-low seven figures). He worked in the paper mill to put himself through Oregon State (Engineering Degree), then let Tektronix pay for his MBA. Without that piece of paper, he'd still be working in the paper mill. :yesnod:

That was then, this is now. They are smart enough to know that times have changed.

I actually think you are showing both sides of the same coin.:cert:

[Entropy]

Like anything in life, a goal is needed for most to achieve. Attempting something without a goal in mind is a good pathway to failure.

For some here, that meant no college necessary. For me and Waco, it meant a lot of school.

I teach a lot of kids who don't have a goal, and plenty who do. Guess which ones succeed?

[polarbear]

That was then, this is now. They are smart enough to know that times have changed.

I actually think you are showing both sides of the same coin.:cert:

good catch on the spelling btw :seasix:

[NeedSpeed]

Look, I think everyone has pretty much missed the boat on education.

I have a masters in Electrical Engineering and I teach on the side. I develop software for a living.

Was college necessary??? No. What should you take from college? How to TEACH YOURSELF. Yes, that's it. I don't care what degree you get, that's what you need to learn. Look at IT. Anything you learn is outdated. School can't keep up with industry. Yes, there are skills that can be taught, but at the end of the day you need to learn to adapt.

[kingpin]

Look, I think everyone has pretty much missed the boat on education.

I have a masters in Electrical Engineering and I teach on the side. I develop software for a living.

Was college necessary??? No. What should you take from college? How to TEACH YOURSELF. Yes, that's it. I don't care what degree you get, that's what you need to learn. Look at IT. Anything you learn is outdated. School can't keep up with industry. Yes, there are skills that can be taught, but at the end of the day you need to learn to adapt.

You're an EE. YHGTBSM! :lol:

[JRC27]

Don't Need a College Degree -- College is Overrated (http://learnfinancialplanning.com/why-you-dont-need-a-college-degree/)

That article is meaningless

[Mike Mercury]

No. What should you take from college? How to TEACH YOURSELF. Yes, that's it.

http://www.tim-yvonne.com/gif/bell1.gif

College text books are available to anyone. Just read them yourself. Why pay to have a professor (who's probably 40'ish and still lives with his mommy)
verbalize - what is in the very college text book you can read for yourself.

Sadly today, there are a lot of naturally capable/productive people not-being interviewed because they don't have a degree; and there's a lot of degreed people being interviewed solely because they have a degree - that are not capable producers.

[Olustee bus]

for sure worth it to me. I was an accountant (CPA). could not have done it without it.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

for sure worth it to me. I was an accountant (CPA). could not have done it without it.

So you crunched numbers your entire life, or did you move on to something else?

[NEVRL8T]

I went to the college of hard knocks. :D

No college, no degree, all I could do to fight my way oughtta high school.
I went straight to work right outta the 12th grade, at my Dads scrap metal business. Years later, My brother and I bought the business & ran it better than our Dad. Sold it and retired relatively young.
I did well with no degree, but there are days when I can't help but think "What if ?"
I took a business administration course at a community college for one semester when I was about 27-28. Rarely cracked a book, was bored as hell, and my score was 3rd highest in the class. Would have been 2nd had I not argued a point about business with the teacher.
But I've made damn sure that my 2 sons and wife have had some college experience.
My wife went back to school at age 38, worked part time, and graduated with a degree in education when she was 45.
She's my hero.:)

You and I have a lot in common. I work in my family's business and did some of the same things you did. Went to work straight out of high school. Several different jobs, pushing dope to support my habits was one of them. Years later, a wife and kids, I went to college in 2005 at the local community college. I have an associates degree in applied science with an emphasis on general construction management. I graduated in the 1% of my class. It was a bitch but I did it. It took me four years to complete a two year course at night. Yes, I use my degree everyday in my job in my family's commercial floor covering contracting business. Would I have this job without the degree? Certainly. Does the degree help me in my job? Without a doubt.

[mrvette]

http://www.tim-yvonne.com/gif/bell1.gif

College text books are available to anyone. Just read them yourself. Why pay to have a professor (who's probably 40'ish and still lives with his mommy)
verbalize - what is in the very college text book you can read for yourself.

Sadly today, there are a lot of naturally capable/productive people not-being interviewed because they don't have a degree; and there's a lot of degreed people being interviewed solely because they have a degree - that are not capable producers.

Speaking of school books from elementary through PHD level, they need drop the stupid hard bound high cost paper bullshit, and publish like comic book bound on newsprint, and reduce the cost per book down to maybe 20 bux each, which is more in line with value.....

this shit of 150 buck textbooks is just stupid.....

:kick:

[Entropy]

http://www.tim-yvonne.com/gif/bell1.gif

College text books are available to anyone. Just read them yourself. Why pay to have a professor (who's probably 40'ish and still lives with his mommy)
verbalize - what is in the very college text book you can read for yourself.

Sadly today, there are a lot of naturally capable/productive people not-being interviewed because they don't have a degree; and there's a lot of degreed people being interviewed solely because they have a degree - that are not capable producers.
Nice. Classy.

Think about this: How long has the printing press and reading been in circulation for?

How did we pass on information before that time?

Which do you think humans are better at?

FTR: I'm in my early 30s, living on my own, and I actually support my parents.

[Entropy]

Speaking of school books from elementary through PHD level, they need drop the stupid hard bound high cost paper bullshit, and publish like comic book bound on newsprint, and reduce the cost per book down to maybe 20 bux each, which is more in line with value.....

this shit of 150 buck textbooks is just stupid.....

:kick:
Reducing costs for students is a priority around here, but going to a non-bound book in a 3 ring binder maybe knocks $20 off the price.

Either we're getting fleeced, or the cost doesn't lie in the binding.

Part I don't like, is that students can't sell the book back and recoup some of the cost.

I'm looking harder and harder at electronic/interactive books. It's more interesting to look at and read for sure, but I'm not sure if it's actually viable or a novelty at this point.

[mrvette]

Reducing costs for students is a priority around here, but going to a non-bound book in a 3 ring binder maybe knocks $20 off the price.

Either we're getting fleeced, or the cost doesn't lie in the binding.

Part I don't like, is that students can't sell the book back and recoup some of the cost.

I'm looking harder and harder at electronic/interactive books. It's more interesting to look at and read for sure, but I'm not sure if it's actually viable or a novelty at this point.

THE most profitable industry in this country gotta be textbooks, both the the publishers/printers and the authors.....150 bux for a book that is worth 20 is a stone rip off, no matter how it's looked at.....

:beat:

[NB2K]

good catch on the spelling btw :seasix:

Old fan of Tektronix.

[mrvette]

Old fan of Tektronix.

I probably the only other guy here that ever heard of them, so did I mis spell the name here??

I have a old 453 scope they made back in the early 70's is my best guess....

been a while, still works good though...

:lol::cert:

[repo]

Books are a big scam, but we sold all my sons from last semester already.:shots:

[NB2K]

Books are a big scam, but we sold all my sons from last semester already.:shots:

huuuuge scam.

Publishers and colleges have been fighting ebooks tooth and nail, but the toothpaste is out of the tube.

Do we really need an updated and new college algebra textbook every two years?

[Olustee bus]

So you crunched numbers your entire life, or did you move on to something else?


I basically quit crunching numbers in the last third of my career. I still was required to deal with numbers but I was not an accountant. I moved up. and out after 40 plus years.

[NB2K]

You and I have a lot in common. I work in my family's business and did some of the same things you did. Went to work straight out of high school. Several different jobs, pushing dope to support my habits was one of them. Years later, a wife and kids, I went to college in 2005 at the local community college. I have an associates degree in applied science with an emphasis on general construction management. I graduated in the 1% of my class. It was a bitch but I did it. It took me four years to complete a two year course at night. Yes, I use my degree everyday in my job in my family's commercial floor covering contracting business. Would I have this job without the degree? Certainly. Does the degree help me in my job? Without a doubt.

:cert:

That's what my Dad did, Loyola '73.

[Mike Mercury]

Nice. Classy.

Think about this: How long has the printing press and reading been in circulation for?

How did we pass on information before that time?

Which do you think humans are better at?

FTR: I'm in my early 30s, living on my own, and I actually support my parents.

I don't know the point you're trying to make here; unless you are just doing a "support my ___________ " cheerleading exercise.

I know quite a few professors that I wouldn't trust to change batteries in a flashlight. One is a relative; who has his PHD in Chemistry.

I don't have one college minute of credit. And it's almost impossible to get an interview with companies that are desperately looking for someone with my capabilities.

I interviewed with Kodak 6-7 years ago; for a electronic engineer position I could of done in my sleep; and would of excelled at the work.

But the HR guy refused to grant me a second interview because "we don't hire people without degrees". The department manager wanted me; and he threatened to go-over the HR guys head - to get me onboard. During this delay; I received an offer at a different company; and went there instead.

Is it possible that - because of people like you - that people like me are denied hire?

There are still companies that will hire technical people without degrees - if there's a proven work history. At my current employer, new employee prospects get zero points for having a degree. They've been burned too many times in the past. We need capable people; degreed or not is moot.

[Doug28450]

I got a degree in Civil Engineering with emphasis in structures. I would not have been a U.S, Navy pilot without a college degree. The fact that it is a technical degree helped get accepted. Additionally, I would not have been able to get licensing as a Professional Engineer and Structural Engineer without the degree.

I still perform design, although not as much as I did a few years ago.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

I love Demi Moore.

[NB2K]

I don't know the point you're trying to make here; unless you are just doing a "support my ___________ " cheerleading exercise.

I know quite a few professors that I wouldn't trust to change batteries in a flashlight. One is a relative; who has his PHD in Chemistry.

I don't have one college minute of credit. And it's almost impossible to get an interview with companies that are desperately looking for someone with my capabilities.

I interviewed with Kodak 6-7 years ago; for a electronic engineer position I could of done in my sleep; and would of excelled at the work.

But the HR guy refused to grant me a second interview because "we don't hire people without degrees". The department manager wanted me; and he threatened to go-over the HR guys head - to get me onboard. During this delay; I received an offer at a different company; and went there instead.

Is it possible that - because of people like you - that people like me are denied hire?

There are still companies that will hire technical people without degrees - if there's a proven work history. At my current employer, new employee prospects get zero points for having a degree. They've been burned too many times in the past. We need capable people; degreed or not is moot.

So if you had a son or daughter graduating from high school in 2012 what would you recommend they do?

[Mike Mercury]

So if you had a son or daughter graduating from high school in 2012 what would you recommend they do?

we've changed subjects; and on this one I'd tell them to get a degree; at least a two year... so as to get interviews. :yesnod:

It is the world we now live in.

[NB2K]

we've changed subjects; and on this one I'd tell them to get a degree; at least a two year - to get started. :yesnod:

:iagree:

And you may have lucked out on that Kodak deal; they are about to go under.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

And I still love Demi Moore.

[Mike Mercury]

:iagree:

And you may have lucked out on that Kodak deal; they are about to go under.

:lol:

There was a CF member that worked for them for awhile; I was PM'ing him during that process. My neighbor is retired from Kodak, and introduced me to their manufacturing department head; that's how I got the first interview.

I hate to tell the cult this... but a company saying "we don't hire people without degrees" - is not a reason to orgasm.

[Stangkiller]

I wouldn't have been in my field without my degree (accounting). I make more than I would have if I were a specialist at a transmission shop (where I worked in high school) plus I don't do manual labor as a career. So yes it was well worth the 3.5 years.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

I don't do manual labor as a career
Those guys are all drunken losers. We should make them ride in the back of the bus. Maybe segregate the water fountains in schools.

[Stangkiller]

Those guys are all drunken losers. We should make them ride in the back of the bus. Maybe segregate the water fountains in schools.

Umm no not what i'm getting at. I broke my hand in high school and realized if I were in a manual labor position, my paycheck would have suffered greatly. So from that point forward I knew I wanted to be in a more traditional office setting. :yesnod:

I do get a little stir crazy in the office and can certainly see the draw to actually doing physical work, shit I still wish I was sometimes. :yesnod:

[RedLS1GTO]

A hypothetical scenario for the anti-college folks here...

You own a company that makes widgets and need to hire an engineer to work on and help perfect the design of your latest creation. Your budget at the moment won't allow you to go after one with decades of experience so you have to hire someone at an entry level pay scale.

You have 2 applicants. The first seems like a good kid with a good head on his shoulders whose resume consists of part time work at a fast food joint through high school. The other is wet behind the ears, fresh out of college with an ME degree from a well respected school.

Which one do you hire? Are you going to hire the first and give him a few years of on the job training in the basic concepts and mathematical theories of engineering and hope that he picks it up eventually? I think not. Even though neither has any experience to speak of... one of them has that little piece of paper that says he understands at least the basic concepts, principles, and has at least some knowledge of how mechanical things work from a mathematical standpoint.


Does a college degree mean you are smarter, a harder worker, more knowledgable, or anything of the sort? No... not at all... but in many professions, especially those that are math and science based, what is learned in those classrooms is the foundation for all of the experience that then follows it.

As I sit at my computer today analyzing the energy consumption of the sealed system of a billion dollar refrigeration program, I think that sitting through the misery of thermodynamics, the cad classes, the computer science classes, the statics and dynamics classes, and quite a few others are starting to pay off. Could I learn it "on the job" or with books on my own? I'm sure I could... but instead, I was able to jump right in and be an asset to my company from day 1 despite never doing anything close to this at any previous job.

[repo]

But the HR guy refused to grant me a second interview because "we don't hire people without degrees".

No wonder they went under. Why would they waste your/their time with a first interview?:slap:

[Burro (He/Haw)]

As I sit at my computer today analyzing the energy consumption of the sealed system of a billion dollar refrigeration program
As I sit at my computer ANALysing today's porn offerings, I think to myself; "Pretty soon I'm gonna have to go repair this billion dollar refrigeration system some engineer who doesn't own a pair of work boots designed without isolation valves because he wanted to save $200.00. :D

[NB2K]

As I sit at my computer ANALysing today's porn offerings, I think to myself; "Pretty soon I'm gonna have to go repair this billion dollar refrigeration system some engineer who doesn't own a pair of work boots designed without isolation valves because he wanted to save $200.00. :D

Sorry, man.

I was bangin' Demi Moore and just kinda forget.

[Stangkiller]

Sorry, man.

I was bangin' Demi Moore and just kinda forget.

I thought it was cause she used the isolation valve as a bong and you really didn't want to order more :confused5:

[Mike Mercury]

A hypothetical scenario for the anti-college folks here...




a. I haven't read any reply from someone that's "anti" college; though I did't read all the responses.

b. hypotheticals... are for the book worms. I have to perform & deliver results in my line of work. I can't spend time wondering about what-if's.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

I thought it was cause she used the isolation valve as a bong and you really didn't want to order more :confused5:

Cheap engineers. "Wait till I gotta come out and shut your plant down to make ONE crummy weld because YOU skimped on isolation valves!" the arguments goes. :D

[Stangkiller]

Cheap engineers. "Wait till I gotta come out and shut your plant down to make ONE crummy weld because YOU skimped on isolation valves!" the arguments goes. :D

From my experience with engineers they would have made the original drawings with multiple back ups to the isolation valve you want. It's when us accountants get our hands on the plans and say we aren't sending men to mars, we need it to be half that cost. That stupid shit like that gets cut out of the plans. :yesnod:

[Burro (He/Haw)]

accountants get our hands on the plans
So it's YOUR fault!!

[Stangkiller]

So it's YOUR fault!!

:yesnod: you can call it job security.

[RedLS1GTO]

...some engineer who doesn't own a pair of work boots

The flaw in your comment is that I own many pairs of worn out work boots. Just because I can sit at a computer and design and analyze it doesn't mean I can't go get my hands dirty.

The idea that seems to exist that those with the degrees and education don't have the common sense, "real world" knowledge, and mechanical aptitude is no less ignorant than the idea that those without degrees aren't as smart.


...as for the $200, I could go into a cost of quality discussion but I don't think that would accomplish too much.

b. hypotheticals... are for the book worms. I have to perform & deliver results in my line of work. I can't spend time wondering about what-if's.

:skep:

This isn't your line of work. This is an online discussion. Unless of course you just don't want to answer the very simple question that I presented...

I think that when you consider Billion dollar engineering projects, the results are fairly important in my line of work too... don't you agree?

[Burro (He/Haw)]

:yesnod: you can call it job security.

Valves and supports. Always always always. :D

[neece]

I have an associates degree in general business and a bachelors in business administration (both with honors).:D I just wanted my college degree, makes me more well rounded.lol. My brother told me I wouldn't do right by myself if I didn't go back to school, so at 27, I did. I loved my college experience. Both of my parents had some college as non-traditional students, got jobs with ma bell as young 20-something's, and retired with such knowledge of how the phone company works that a college grad today would never know, or even need to know nowadays. My favorite college business professors were the one's who had worked in the private sector....learned much more from them than the Ph.D.'s who only had classroom experience. Kids should go to college mainly for the opportunity to learn how to write well in life, it is the one skill needed for most every job.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

The flaw in your comment
And the flaw in yours is mine was a joke. :rofl:

..as for the $200, I could go into a cost of quality discussion but I don't think that would accomplish too much.
Why not? Because you are so smart!?!? :lol:

[RedLS1GTO]

And the flaw in yours is mine was a joke. :rofl:

If yours was a joke... great... but that doesn't change the fact that that line of thinking is very real for some. Working in the plants and on shop floors I hear it constantly.

Why not? Because you are so smart!?!? :lol:

No, because arguing that on the internet would be beyond stupid and I have nerdy computer things to do for work.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

No, because arguing that on the internet would be beyond stupid and I have nerdy computer things to do for work.
:lol::lol:

[Entropy]

I don't know the point you're trying to make here; unless you are just doing a "support my ___________ " cheerleading exercise.

I know quite a few professors that I wouldn't trust to change batteries in a flashlight. One is a relative; who has his PHD in Chemistry.

I don't have one college minute of credit. And it's almost impossible to get an interview with companies that are desperately looking for someone with my capabilities.

I interviewed with Kodak 6-7 years ago; for a electronic engineer position I could of done in my sleep; and would of excelled at the work.

But the HR guy refused to grant me a second interview because "we don't hire people without degrees". The department manager wanted me; and he threatened to go-over the HR guys head - to get me onboard. During this delay; I received an offer at a different company; and went there instead.

Is it possible that - because of people like you - that people like me are denied hire?

There are still companies that will hire technical people without degrees - if there's a proven work history. At my current employer, new employee prospects get zero points for having a degree. They've been burned too many times in the past. We need capable people; degreed or not is moot.
What I'm getting at is that most students, myself included, are audio/visual learners.

Reading a book isn't enough. I sucked (relatively) at coursework, but was a whiz in lab.

Until the advent of the printing press, most knowledge was passed on through direct interactions and experience. Since that's how we developed, that's still the preferred method for most people to learn.

I call it job security.

It sucks that you couldn't get a second interview because you didn't have a degree, but that's the prerogative of the company, and many of them are willing to make that choice, due to what happens at college: You get rid of chaff and release some wheat.

[repo]

Maybe I should start a repo school division at ITT. The rest of their programs are a scam, what's one more? :ball:

[Z06David]

I'm a materials engineer and I have used what I've learned in college quite often. There is no way a non-degree'd person could do my job unless they were working in this area for 20 years.

[Stangkiller]

Maybe I should start a repo school division at ITT. The rest of their programs are a scam, what's one more? :ball:

I thought that's what those REPO reality TV shows were.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

Maybe I should start a repo school division at ITT. The rest of their programs are a scam, what's one more? :ball:

Lets ask mrvette!

[Mike Mercury]

Kids should go to college mainly for the opportunity to learn how to write well in life, it is the one skill needed for most every job.

do you really believe that "good writing skills" are only to be taught/learned/found at a college campus?

There is no way a non-degree'd person could do my job unless they were working in this area for 20 years.

what are you saying here :confused:

that the information is secret... and only spoken of on-campus (where no one else could ever have access to it away from the college grounds)?

or are you admitting you were incabable of mastering the information on your own - in 4 years; and required a professor to dictate everything to you; and set your study schedules for you?

[Burro (He/Haw)]

or are you admitting you were incabable of mastering the information on your own - in 4 years; and required a professor to dictate everything to you; and set your study schedules for you?
Look at the Mercury layin' the splash on Z06David! He's makin' you his BITCH, bish!

[Mike Mercury]

Look at the Mercury layin' the splash on Z06David! He's makin' you his BITCH, bish!

Hey; I'm not trying to bash anyone.

I just think it's kinda comical that a person actually believes that no-one else is capable of learning the same thing as they - in the same time frame, without the aid of a college classroom and/or professor.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

Hey; I'm not trying to bash anyone.

I just think it's kinda comical that a person actually believes that no-one else is capable of learning the same thing as they - in the same time frame, without the aid of a college classroom and/or professor.
When you put it like that, I agree.

[Truck Guy]

Hey; I'm not trying to bash anyone.

I just think it's kinda comical that a person actually believes that no-one else is capable of learning the same thing as they - in the same time frame, without the aid of a college classroom and/or professor.What few people know is that a drunkin' one eyed monkey could probably do their job in most cases. :D

[Burro (He/Haw)]

What few people know is that a drunkin' one eyed monkey could probably do their job in most cases.
Having sexual relations with animals is against the law.

[dwjz06]

I chose the service instead of college. I did go back to school, but did not finish. It is a regret. 1. I could have made more money like most of my buddies that finished college. 2. Because I did not finish. 3. My wife rags my ass about it.:D just some of the reasons.

I do not need the degree for my current job, but if I ever leave or lose it. The company would make it a degree required job.

I would have one hell of a time trying to get work without one in today's market. It seems 30 plus years of work experience only gets you so far. So i would vote for get the degree.:cert:

[polarbear]

I chose the service instead of college. I did go back to school, but did not finish. It is a regret. 1. I could have made more money like most of my buddies that finished college. 2. Because I did not finish. 3. My wife rags my ass about it.:D just some of the reasons.

I do not need the degree for my current job, but if I ever leave or lose it. The company would make it a degree required job.

I would have one hell of a time trying to get work without one in today's market. It seems 30 plus years of work experience only gets you so far. So i would vote for get the degree. :cert:

:iagree: That's really the bottom line. I gave up years ago trying to analyse why the world works the way it does, but I'm getting real good at understanding how it works. :yesnod:

[LATB]

There is no way a non-degree'd person could do my job unless they were working in this area for 20 years.

There is no way a degreed person could do my job unless they were working in this area for 40 years.

btw..."degreed" is not spelled with an apostrophe.


your move. :D

[FasterTraffic]

I think the two camps are arguing different sides of the same coin.

Theoretically, could a person learn everything necessary to be proficient in any occupation, given enough time? Yes.

Realistically, is that an option for most occupations, especially ones with increasingly technical skills and expertise required? No.

The Vivien Thomas story is the exception that proves the rule.

[Burro (He/Haw)]

The argument "I could do that job" cracks me up. No you couldn't, or you would be.

Unless it's a job as a fluffer in the porn industry. We have plenty of knobslobbers around here.

[neece]

do you really believe that "good writing skills" are only to be taught/learned/found at a college

No, not necessarily. But in a couple of college classes I took we had to grade other students' papers, and some students writing skills were terrible. There is a reason you have to write so many papers while in college. You should come away with the knowledge of how to write in a professional manner. Look back in your life and figure how many times you have had to write a professional letter. I have written many and I am way younger than you. :D Good writing skills benefit one well in life....too bad so many people write like they speak.

[LATB]

The argument "I could do that job" cracks me up. No you couldn't, or you would be.


incorrect

[Burro (He/Haw)]

Good writing skills benefit one well in life
Coming from one who basically writes for a living, I agree with the foxy chick.

[Z06David]

These threads are funny :lol: