That SEC west is a tough ****ing division [Archive]

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NEVRL8T

11-20-2011, 7:21pm

That is all. :seasix:

boracayjohnny

11-20-2011, 7:23pm

You know, I was looking for a place to put this.....

http://i406.photobucket.com/albums/pp141/boracayjohnny/funny%201/Seatstaken.jpg

Additionally, you're in the middle of your division and still third in the nation.....

http://i406.photobucket.com/albums/pp141/boracayjohnny/funny%201/haters.jpg

RedLS1GTO

11-20-2011, 9:02pm

NEVRL8T

11-20-2011, 9:34pm

NEVRL8T

11-20-2011, 9:36pm

If I remember correctly... a bunch folks got really bent out of shape and defensive recently of my comments that Stanford should have been ahead of Alabama. The reasoning for that was that the SoS calculations (that favored Bama at the time) should be THE determining factor in the rankings. Remember that?

With that said, what do you have to say now that Oklahoma State is ranked #2 according to the math and SoS calculations, but is 4th, behind 2 more SEC teams due to the human vote?

Are you going to stick to your position that SoS and the math is more important... or is that only the argument when it favors your teams?

Can you please post the math and SoS calculations. I still can't see how Oklahoma State could have a tougher schedule than the SEC west. If you can show it to me, I may have a rebuttal or may totally agree with you. Besides, I don't think I argued much with you on Stanford.

RedLS1GTO

11-20-2011, 9:39pm

Can you please post the math and SoS calculations. I still can't see how Oklahoma State could have a tougher schedule than the SEC west. If you can show it to me, I may have a rebuttal or may totally agree with you. Besides, I don't think I argued much with you on Stanford.

I don't know where to find the actual numbers... They said it twice on the BCS countdown show on ESPN.

EDIT:

Found it.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/bcs

OSU is at .950 on the computer side compared to .930 for Bama and .870 for Arkansas.

NEVRL8T

11-20-2011, 9:43pm

I don't know where to find the actual numbers... They said it twice on the BCS countdown show on ESPN.

I am glad you didn't take that the wrong way. I was serious, I can't find that info either. But look at it this way, OSU lost to an unranked team, Oklahoma lost to an unranked team and a 22nd ranked Baylor, Oregon lost to an LSU and a lower ranked USC, Arkansas' only loss is to Alabama, who was ranked number one at the time.

boracayjohnny

11-20-2011, 9:46pm

Yes, but when that division has Alabama and LSU in it, ho hum.

Let me be clear, the haters gonna hate was not a dig at you or the Hogs. Actually, it was an ibthaters, read anti-SEC, kinda post. Which, I can see, worked. :D

NEVRL8T

11-20-2011, 9:48pm

OSU has played three ranked teams:

Texas A & M
Texas
Kansas State

And will play a fourth in Oklahoma

(The link you provided does not show Baylor as being ranked)

Arkansas has played four ranked teams:

Alabama
Texas A & M
South Carolina
Auburn

And will play a fifth in current BCS number one, LSU

Doesn't that schedule look tougher to you than Oklahoma States?

RedLS1GTO

11-20-2011, 9:48pm

I am glad you didn't take that the wrong way. I was serious, I can't find that info either. But look at it this way, OSU lost to an unranked team, Oklahoma lost to an unranked team and a 22nd ranked Baylor, Oregon lost to an LSU and a lower ranked USC, Arkansas' only loss is to Alabama, who was ranked number one at the time.

I'm not at all arguing with you on it.

I don't personally think that OSU should be #2 after a loss to an unranked team... just thought it was funny that the argument that I got bombarded with last time now goes the other way.

RedLS1GTO

11-20-2011, 9:49pm

Let me be clear, the haters gonna hate was not a dig at you or the Hogs. Actually, it was an ibthaters kinda post. Which, I can see, worked. :D

So after your defense of Alabama last time based on SoS... should OSU be ranked #2 now?

...or do you only like to use the math and SoS argument when it favors your position?

NEVRL8T

11-20-2011, 9:50pm

Let me be clear, the haters gonna hate was not a dig at you or the Hogs. Actually, it was an ibthaters, read anti-SEC, kinda post. Which, I can see, worked. :D

I can't wait until Friday. I am so nervous. But, we are gonna send that aerial attack and exotic running game to Baton Rouge and walk out of there with a number two ranking. :D

Y2Kvert4me

11-20-2011, 9:52pm

I can't wait until Friday. I am so nervous. But, we are gonna send that aerial attack and exotic running game to Baton Rouge and walk out of there with a number two ranking. :D:lol:

boracayjohnny

11-20-2011, 10:04pm

I can't wait until Friday. I am so nervous. But, we are gonna send that aerial attack and exotic running game to Baton Rouge and walk out of there with a number two ranking. :D

Then we're both nervous. The deal is y'all have had the most Ws lately. I sure hope ole Les and even Brick (Def Line Coach), I love that name, have an answer and even a few trickerations for anything Hog related this year. Let's get it on!

boracayjohnny

11-20-2011, 10:17pm

So after your defense of Alabama last time based on SoS... should OSU be ranked #2 now?

...or do you only like to use the math and SoS argument when it favors your position?

The answer is no. The reason is due to what neverl8t posted. Then, the strength of schedule, which shows them very close, is not the deal breaker. The deal breaker is the un-ranked team loss.

RedLS1GTO

11-20-2011, 10:19pm

The answer is no. The reason is due to what neverl8t posted. Then, the strength of schedule, which shows them very close, is not the deal breaker. The deal breaker is the un-ranked team loss.

But, but, but...

Bama is playing a harder schedule. Period. Why shouldn't they be ranked ahead of Stanford...

So, the answer is logically the SOS...

(there are more to that same effect, but I didn't feel like reading through the rest of the crap again)

So basically, you only use the math and SoS when it favors your position. I figured as much, but thanks for clearing it up. :thumbs:

boracayjohnny

11-20-2011, 10:22pm

But, but, but...

(there are more to that same effect, but I didn't feel like reading through the rest of the crap again)

So basically, you only use the math and SoS when it favors your position. I figured as much, but thanks for clearing it up. :thumbs:

:lol:

You trying to twist the words into your favor is not working. Good try, chief.

Y2Kvert4me

11-20-2011, 10:33pm

The answer a couple weeks ago is that Bama was deservedly ranked higher than (undefeated) Stanford. Those cards fell right into place. Nothing surprising at all, the rank system was correct.

When I stated that, I was told better (1 loss) teams shouldn't be ranked higher than undefeated teams, even though it was obvious they were a better team.

If the better team can't be ranked higher, WTF is the point of ranking? :skep:

RedLS1GTO

11-20-2011, 11:53pm

You trying to twist the words into your favor is not working. Good try, chief.

Your entire argument was that Alabama should be ranked ahead of Stanford based on SoS. The quotes are there to back it up...

Bama is playing a harder schedule. Period. Why shouldn't they be ranked ahead of Stanford...

Now, regardless of your, my, or anyone's opinion of who has the tougher schedule, the unbiased computers say that OSU has a higher SoS than Alabama or Arkansas. That is not arguable. It is right in front of you in numbers.

What part of that am I twisting?

The answer a couple weeks ago is that Bama was deservedly ranked higher than (undefeated) Stanford. Those cards fell right into place. Nothing surprising at all, the rank system was correct.

When I stated that, I was told better (1 loss) teams shouldn't be ranked higher than undefeated teams, even though it was obvious they were a better team.

If the better team can't be ranked higher, WTF is the point of ranking? :skep:

Based on what? This is what you said then...

This is precisely why ranking, especially one factoring SoS, is much more meaningful than a simple w/l record.

Now the math shows that OSU has the higher SoS and should be #2, and you are saying that doesn't matter and it should be based on the completely unquantifiable perception of who is "better" as judged by humans.

I can't even imagine the epic amount of bitching that would be happening if the reverse was true and the numbers showed Bama or Arkansas to be better than OSU but they were ranked behind them.

I have no skin in this one at all. My Alma Mater will be lucky to go to the WGAF bowl in Canada somewhere. I honestly don't care which of them is ranked where... I just think the bias and hypocrisy of the arguments from week to week is amusing.

boracayjohnny

11-21-2011, 12:34am

Your entire argument was that Alabama should be ranked ahead of Stanford based on SoS. The qoutes are there to back it up...

Now, regardless of your, my, or anyone's opinion of who has the tougher schedule, the unbiased computers say that OSU has a higher SoS than Alabama or Arkansas. That is not arguable. It is right in front of you in numbers.

What part of that am I twisting?

Based on what? This is what you said then...

Now the math shows that OSU has the higher SoS and should be #2, and you are saying that doesn't matter and it should be based on the completely unquantifiable perception of who is "better" as judged by humans.

I can't even imagine the epic amount of bitching that would be happening if the reverse was true and the numbers showed Bama or Arkansas to be better than OSU but they were ranked behind them.

I have no skin in this one at all. My Alma Mater will be lucky to go to the WGAF bowl in Canada somewhere. I honestly don't care which of them is ranked where... I just think the bias and hypocrisy of the arguments from week to week is amusing.

:lol:

You gotta stop, you're killing me.

You have a question to ask yourself to figure out who belongs where. Which one of the four teams lost to an un-ranked team?

SOS by itself and only by itself would put OSU ahead, however, SOS goes out the window when OSU loses to an unranked and is the only one of the four to lose to an un-ranked. I would support Arky or Bama being fourth if their loss was to an un-ranked. Hell, I don't even know if I would support LSU being fourth if they lost to an un-ranked if in the same situation. They might even deserve to be lower. Please tell me that's being biased and/or hypocritical.

Yet, with all that said, there are still more games to play and, as this weekend proved, upsets can and will happen. No one knows where any team will be until the last game is played. Ole Lester could go out Friday and start munching grass on the field while the game is being played or Petrino could start dancing in the stands when a time out is called. Who knows?

Back to you in the "I'm right and others are morally bankrupt" section, Red.

oyealiz

11-21-2011, 1:08am

I can't wait until Friday. I am so nervous. But, we are gonna send that aerial attack and exotic running game to Baton Rouge and walk out of there with a number two ranking. :D

Death Valley....Where the pigs are going to eat slop. :D

I just think the bias and hypocrisy of the arguments from week to week is amusing.

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR6iJorAC9HeovdxoJKYxRou0eHpm2vek4kII1s8KEmlqPQoAsIPAaOsA

RedLS1GTO

11-21-2011, 1:56am

You have a question to ask yourself to figure out who belongs where. Which one of the four teams lost to an un-ranked team?

You really need pay more attention. I already said that I don't think OSU should be ranked #2... multiple times.

I am simply pointing out how invalid your (and a few others) previous argument was when you tried to say that Alabama should be ranked ahead of Stanford based solely on their SoS being tougher, which no matter how you try to spin it now, was EXACTLY what you said.

You SEC mofos certainly are a touchy bunch.

boracayjohnny

11-21-2011, 7:21am

You really need pay more attention. I already said that I don't think OSU should be ranked #2... multiple times.

I am simply pointing out how invalid your (and a few others) previous argument was when you tried to say that Alabama should be ranked ahead of Stanford based solely on their SoS being tougher, which no matter how you try to spin it now, was EXACTLY what you said.

You SEC mofos certainly are a touchy bunch.

That was my mistake to let you think I would only judge by SOS. Somehow, I had the idea of you asking a question involving only the SOS. But, hey, whatever. I know you're all butt hurt the sun doesn't revolve around the Big Ten now. It just so happens the dominant football conference lately is the "dumb ole hicks in the Ess-E-Cee" and it brings out the hate.

NB2K

11-21-2011, 7:36am

NEVRL8T

11-21-2011, 9:07am

I think SOS is only a part of the deal, as voters' weight is a bigger part of the equation.
No way am I knocking SOS as that's why LSU got into the game in '07. It may also be why Bama gets into it this year.

I would rather play Bama again (LSU owns Bama simce 2000) than them pesky 'Hogs.:D

After Friday, you won't have to worry about that. :D

Here is an interesting scene though. There are still conference championship games to play. Say Arkansas does beat LSU and 'Bama plays Georgia for the SEC Championship, then OSU plays whoever for their championship and wins (of course they still have to get by Oklahoma too), then where do the Hogs rank since they will not play another game after Friday? Does OSU jump the Hogs into number two? If so, we are right back where we started from. What if Georgia wins? Of course, if LSU wins - this is all a moot point. Arkansas falls back to fifth or sixth and probably heads to the Capitol One/Cotton Bowl.

BTW, the line for Fridays game is LSU by 13.5

cmb396

11-21-2011, 10:13am

Tell me about it!! UT had the worst possible draw of SECW teams this year!! And speaking of SoS, UT had the hardest according to the NCAA.

I'm really excited to see the Rkansas/LSU game this week tho!! It looks like a SECW NC game is almost inevitable!

Will

11-21-2011, 10:17am

#1, #2, #3, AND the defending national championship.

Not to mention the "bottom-feeders" Miss. State and Ole Miss, BOTH of whom routinely have top 25 recruiting classes.

Best of the best, bar none. East has been slipping, time to pick up the pace.

NB2K

11-21-2011, 10:26am

After Friday, you won't have to worry about that. :D

Here is an interesting scene though. There are still conference championship games to play. Say Arkansas does beat LSU and 'Bama plays Georgia for the SEC Championship, then OSU plays whoever for their championship and wins (of course they still have to get by Oklahoma too), then where do the Hogs rank since they will not play another game after Friday? Does OSU jump the Hogs into number two? If so, we are right back where we started from. What if Georgia wins? Of course, if LSU wins - this is all a moot point. Arkansas falls back to fifth or sixth and probably heads to the Capitol One/Cotton Bowl.

BTW, the line for Fridays game is LSU by 13.5

Crazy numbers, considering the history.

NB2K

11-21-2011, 10:41am

NEVRL8T

11-21-2011, 10:48am

From ESPN:

Alabama, which lost to LSU 9-6 in overtime in Tuscaloosa, Ala., on Nov. 5, might actually be in the best position among the SEC West teams. As long as the Crimson Tide defeats rival Auburn in Saturday's Iron Bowl game, there is a good chance they'll end up playing in the BCS title game -- even if they don't win an SEC championship.

Alabama is going to stomp the piss out of Auburn, especially after what happened last year. That should keep them as a lock in the BCS 2 spot.............unless, LSU loses. Then what? Does LSU fall to 2nd? How could you drop them to 3rd behind 'Bama since they beat 'Bama? How could you drop 'Bama to third since they should beat Auburn and would win? Of course, earlier this year, we beat a number 9 S. Carolina when we were 6th and we fell a spot to 7th.

NEVRL8T

11-21-2011, 10:50am

Bold = doesn't count for much now. :lol:

A & M = High flying offense, no 2nd half defense. You have to admit though, that Arkansas/A & M game was a magnificent display of offense on both sides of the ball.

NB2K

11-21-2011, 10:54am

Alabama is going to stomp the piss out of Auburn, especially after what happened last year. That should keep them as a lock in the BCS 2 spot.............unless, LSU loses. Then what? Does LSU fall to 2nd? How could you drop them to 3rd behind 'Bama since they beat 'Bama? How could you drop 'Bama to third since they should beat Auburn and would win? Of course, earlier this year, we beat a number 9 S. Carolina when we were 6th and we fell a spot to 7th.

Hell, how 'bout this (from an LSU standpoint):

You beat the Oregon, WV, Alabama, Arkansas, Georgia and your reward is:

You get to beat Bama-again. woo-friggin'-hoo.

NEVRL8T

11-21-2011, 10:57am

Hell, how 'bout this (from an LSU standpoint):

You beat the Oregon, WV, Alabama, Arkansas, Georgia and your reward is:

You get to beat Bama-again. woo-friggin'-hoo.

:iagree: I do NOT want to see an LSU/'Bama rematch. If we win I do NOT want to see and LSU/Razorbacks rematch nor do I want to see a Tide/Razorbacks rematch. I would love another shot at the Tide but I want to see an SEC/anyotherconference ass stomping.

NB2K

11-21-2011, 11:02am

:iagree: I do NOT want to see an LSU/'Bama rematch. If we win I do NOT want to see and LSU/Razorbacks rematch nor do I want to see a Tide/Razorbacks rematch. I would love another shot at the Tide but I want to see an SEC/anyotherconference ass stomping.

Me too, but these other mofos are playing themseleves out of the deal.

What if Okie beats Okie lite?

NEVRL8T

11-21-2011, 12:58pm

Me too, but these other mofos are playing themseleves out of the deal.

What if Okie beats Okie lite?

I shudder at the thought. Surely a two loss team doesn't make it into the BCS championship game this year. I mean, its happened before though. :D

NB2K

11-21-2011, 3:05pm

I shudder at the thought. Surely a two loss team doesn't make it into the BCS championship game this year. I mean, its happened before though. :D

Damn right.

I send Dave Wannstedt a Christmas card evey year.:D

boracayjohnny

11-21-2011, 6:36pm

Bold = doesn't count for much now. :lol:

Maybe I've missed it but what's your thoughts on aTm being in the SEC?

Edit:

I'm talking about the behind the scenes stuff such as ESPN was pushing aTm to move.

neece

11-22-2011, 6:22am

There are still some football games left to be played. Don't be counting those chickens....

NEVRL8T

11-22-2011, 7:56am

There are still some football games left to be played. Don't be counting those chickens....

Alabama is sitting in the catbird seat right now.

boracayjohnny

11-22-2011, 8:00am

There are still some football games left to be played. Don't be counting those chickens....

Yep. As was seen this past weekend, strange things can happen. Also, Neece you may like something I found along the way....

http://i406.photobucket.com/albums/pp141/boracayjohnny/funny%201/wjh.png

NEVRL8T

11-23-2011, 12:22pm

ESPN NCAAF Best-case scenarios for Hogs, Tide, Tigers

You’ve heard of “Shark Week” on the Discovery Channel.

Well, this is “SEC Week” in the world of the BCS standings.

For the first time ever, the top three teams in the BCS are not only from the same conference, but the same division.

LSU is No. 1, Alabama No. 2 and Arkansas No. 3, making it extremely likely that we’ll have an all-Western Division matchup (and a rematch) in the Allstate BCS National Championship Game on Jan. 9 in New Orleans.

With that in mind, here’s a best-case scenario for all three teams after consulting with my ESPN colleague Brad Edwards:

LSU

By winning Friday over Arkansas, LSU would go a long way toward locking up a berth in the BCS National Championship Game even if the Tigers were to turn around and lose to Georgia in the SEC championship game.

Now, if LSU were to lose badly to Georgia in the SEC title game, that could conceivably change things.

But LSU’s entire body of work is impressive enough, and the Tigers are so strong in the computers component of the BCS standings that a win over the Hogs would probably be enough to get them to New Orleans even if they tripped up against the Bulldogs on Dec. 3.

The most obvious way for LSU to reach the national title game is to win Friday over Arkansas and then defeat Georgia in the SEC championship game.

ALABAMA

If Alabama can win comfortably over Auburn on Saturday, Edwards thinks the Crimson Tide are about as close as it gets to being a lock for the BCS National Championship Game, especially if LSU wins Friday over Arkansas.

In that scenario, LSU would be the Western Division champion and go to the SEC championship game, while Alabama would stay at home and face very little risk, if any, of dropping any lower than the No. 2 spot in the final BCS standings.

Again, this is provided that Alabama plays well against Auburn and doesn’t just squeak by with a win.

Edwards thinks there’s about a 90- to 95-percent chance that Alabama and LSU would meet in a rematch for the national title if the Crimson Tide and Tigers both win their games this week. And that’s even if LSU were to be upset by Georgia in the SEC championship game.

The reason it’s 90 to 95 percent is because there’s a slim possibility that Oklahoma State could enter the picture should LSU lose in the SEC title game by enough points. The Cowboys are the only other team strong enough in the computers to be in that position, although they still have to face Oklahoma on Dec. 3.

In short, Alabama is in great shape if it wins its game comfortably over Auburn, and it really doesn’t matter at that point what anybody else does.

ARKANSAS

Of the three SEC teams, Arkansas probably has the most cluttered path to the BCS National Championship Game.

The ideal scenario for the Hogs is to win Friday at LSU and have Auburn upset Alabama. Then, Arkansas would go to the SEC championship game with a chance to play its way into the national title game by beating Georgia.

It gets dicey for the Hogs if they win Friday and the Crimson Tide also win Saturday.

At that point, Edwards thinks Arkansas would pass LSU in the two human polls, but that LSU’s high computer ranking would keep the Tigers ahead of the Hogs in the BCS standings.

And if that happens, LSU would be No. 2 in the BCS standings and Alabama No. 1, meaning the Tigers would win the tiebreaker in the West and go to the SEC championship game based on their head-to-head victory over the Crimson Tide during the regular season.

Should LSU go on to lose to Georgia at that point in the SEC title game for its second loss of the season, then it would probably be Alabama and Arkansas in the national title game. But if LSU were to beat Georgia, Edwards thinks the Tigers would edge the Hogs for the No. 2 spot in the final BCS standings.

Again, it would come down to the computers, and there would still be enough of a window for Arkansas to climb into that No. 2 spot over Alabama if the Hogs win impressively enough over LSU and the Crimson Tide aren’t overly impressive against Auburn.

Maybe, then, enough voters would move Arkansas to No. 1 in the two human polls, which could help make up the deficit in the computers.

jaxgator

11-23-2011, 3:40pm

For the first time ever, the top three teams in the BCS are not only from the same conference, but the same division.

Amazing, isn't it? Well, not really, it is the ESS-EEE-SEE baby! :D

ARKANSAS

Of the three SEC teams, Arkansas probably has the most cluttered path to the BCS National Championship Game.

Tough row to hoe for your Hogs Lee but all they can do to help their chances is win. And win BIG. Good luck to your Hogs. :cert:

Oh, and notice how I used the correct color for Arky? :lol:

NB2K

11-23-2011, 4:57pm

Amazing, isn't it? Well, not really, it is the ESS-EEE-SEE baby! :D

Tough row to hoe for your Hogs Lee but all they can do to help their chances is win. And win BIG. Good luck to your Hogs. :cert:

Oh, and notice how I used the correct color for Arky? :lol:

Not that tough.:D

Petrino is 2-1 against Miles and the loss was an OT deal.
Miles and Petrino are about equal as coaches, Chizik 3rd and Saban 4th or so.

I'm sweating this one.

jaxgator

11-23-2011, 5:07pm

Not that tough.:D

Petrino is 2-1 against Miles and the loss was an OT deal.
Miles and Petrino are about equal as coaches, Chizik 3rd and Saban 4th or so.

I'm sweating this one.

As well you should be.

I just meant it would be tough for them to get to the NC game. They have to beat LSU and then hope for other things to happen in their favor.

Should make for an awesome game though and although I favor neither team, I am excited about this game. Same as it was for me with the Bammer/LSU game.

_Nomad_

11-23-2011, 7:00pm

SEC West > *

NEVRL8T

11-23-2011, 7:39pm

Amazing, isn't it? Well, not really, it is the ESS-EEE-SEE baby! :D

Tough row to hoe for your Hogs Lee but all they can do to help their chances is win. And win BIG. Good luck to your Hogs. :cert:

Oh, and notice how I used the correct color for Arky? :lol:

I couldn't figure out how to get the correct color. My options didn't have that one. :lol:

Not that tough.:D

Petrino is 2-1 against Miles and the loss was an OT deal.
Miles and Petrino are about equal as coaches, Chizik 3rd and Saban 4th or so.

I'm sweating this one.

As well you should be.

I just meant it would be tough for them to get to the NC game. They have to beat LSU and then hope for other things to happen in their favor.

Should make for an awesome game though and although I favor neither team, I am excited about this game. Same as it was for me with the Bammer/LSU game.

To tell you the truth, I just want to beat LSU and hope for a BCS bowl game. I know the NC is such a long, long shot - that even if we got it, we would probably screw it up. :rofl:

I just want a BCS game. It looks like if we beat LSU, we will probably still get left out.